• 8,086 replies
    marye
    Joined:
    Bolo24 says: An Idea, Perhaps? Since we're all going to have a fair amount of spare time on our hands for the foreseeable future, what about starting another thread where we all listen to the same show/release on a given day and then share impressions afterward? Folks can submit suggestions and one person (not me) picks what we'll all listen to - call it Deadnet Picks or something. Anyway, if this idea is deemed to have merit, I'd suggest one of the loyal regular posters take the lead and do the picking - y'all can decide who. Might be fun. If it does go forward, I nominate Dick's Picks 18 for the first listen. Been talked about here lately, and, had it been a single show rather than a compilation, we'd probably be talking about it in the same conversation as Cornell, Veneta, etc. Or perhaps even Gainesville?? Stay safe and healthy, friends - this planet needs as many Deadheads as possible.

Comments

sort by
Recent
Reset
  • bob t
    Joined:
    8/13/75 great choice

    This tape is what pulled me in. It's interesting if you have ever heard the full intro, where Bill Graham talks about Ron Rakow and his bet with him that he was being paid 50$. It is right after, "We welcome you on behalf of the group".... After listening to the intro version of one from the vault and what I had on my Make Believe Ballroom tape, it just sounds weird because the intro is awesome!! bob t

  • daverock
    Joined:
    8/13/75 on the radio

    An hour of this show was broadcast on British radio sometime late in 1975. Consequently, my first Dead tape.

  • The Good Ole G…
    Joined:
    Make Believe Ballroom

    Good stuff!

    JIMINMD - Make Believe Ballroom pretty “famous” early bootleg record of 8/13/75 from the Amazing Kornyfone Record Label.

    I think they fetch a pretty penny from collectors these days.

    Cool info here - http://www.gratefulseconds.com/2018/02/?m=1

    Fun Discussions tonight all.

    Good info and Good tunes tomorrow.

    Until then be well

  • DeadVikes
    Joined:
    8/13/75

    Yes, this is the ticket for tomorrow.

    Oroborous, appreciate the information.

    Sounds like I am not in the league of your customers, which is okay. I am more of the pub links player. Anyway, at a minimum it sounds like I should invest in a new router and modem with the extra Wifi connections around the house.

    Do you wonder why I like the old school wired system playing CDs.

    Do you know how much time I have spent on the phone with Sonos customer service??

  • JimInMD
    Joined:
    Ha.. Re: Net Wiring

    Aren't we all geeks in our own way? I couldn't help but read that whole post, much of it lost on me.

    But it lead me to a conclusion. Correct.. Oro, you are not an IT professional. ..but perhaps a bot. not a Russian Bot or a Facebook Bot.. our own SF peace bot.

    I mean that in the most respectful way, hope I did not offend. In a way, Oroborous.. you are all we have in our freak fight against the tyrannists and enemies. We need our own bot.

    Sorry for the diversion. Again, meant with the utmost respect and hopefully a perceived tread of good nature and humor.

    Cousins, thanks for that info.. So that's the source of that language on my tape. Does anyone know the source? The Great American Music Hall is not called the Make Believe Ballroom, right? Was this just a clever name for a bootleg LP to get it past the TM and Copyright folks? There must be another half of this story.

    I guess it doesn't matter if we don't solve this riddle, but how on earth did that LP get it's name?

    Nite all.

  • Oroborous
    Joined:
    Re: Deadvikes/net wiring

    To those not interested, please skip and except my apologies

    First, disclaimer: I am not a IT, computer, or network professional, in fact, when it comes to computers I’m way behind the curve. That being said, I am a custom AV professional which usually requires installing commercial grade networks in the home. I’ve done hundreds over the years. So I have a lot of experience using many AV products both wireless and hard wired. Why, because when you have home automation, Lighting, HVAC, Pool/spas, Security, AV, gaming, WiFi and more on one home network that’s a lot of bandwidth, no matter how many MBS/gigs your paying for. Your network is the foundation that all your net gear lives and depends on. You wouldn’t build your house on a cardboard foundation so you shouldn’t build your network on a insufficient one either!
    SONOS: you are correct that one of the main selling points for Sonos or any of the “wireless” audio products is reasonable stability over WiFi (of course always depending on service. Just like your water main the pipe is only so big)...the biggest of all reasons Sonos is ahead of the pack is their user interface. So with decent service you can certainly enjoy over WiFi, but like you mentioned if everyone is on line at the same time it’s like having every water facet and toilet going at once...,the pipe is only so big...streaming of course is the biggest drain of all.
    I won’t get all in on the phsycics, and I’d probably do a lousy job, but generally, a properly hardwired connection is going to be better: faster, less latency, more BW, and certainly more stable/reliable. I’ve seen situations where the IT guy had me disconnect a HW feed and use a meshed WAP, but that’s mostly because the WiFi gear was new, robust, and of course somewhat oversold lol. The wiring and switches were ancient crap....I may have been trying to use only four conductors which limits you to only 10/100. But that’s only happened a few times in 13 years!
    By comparison our nets are at least 1-5 gig capable, but our bigger new jobs have been 10 gig to try and future proof (as much as that’s possible anymore). Often these start getting into fiber, But I digress...
    Also, even if it’s not that time of day when the whole neighborhood is sucking on basically the same pipe, I’m sure you’ve still experienced huge speed drops, latency, and even severe buffering etc when the whole family is using all those wireless devices. So the more things you can take off WiFi and hardwire, the more those HW devices will benefit from the “bigger pipe” that the wire usually provides, but at the same time, the devices that are still over WiFi will also work better because removing streaming devices off essentially provides “more pipe” for the remaining WiFi devices.
    It’s all about the pipe baby: bigger, faster, stronger...
    The last job I was on before the VID was over 10K Square foot house. It has Comcast gig plus service, using an upgraded surfboard modem, 4 port commercial Router, 4- 48 port Poe switches, Ruckus Zone Director to air traffic control bandwidth where need via the 16 commercial grade Ruckus WAPs (all hardwired on cat five or better). All critical infrastructure gear is on Bluebolts for remote ip monitoring and rebooting.
    Besides the 16 Crestron hardwired touchscreens, there are probably a dozen iPads for control of all house subsystems. The 20+ cameras are now all nest over wifi which is a huge bandwidth drain, but that’s what the owner wanted. Throw in all the personal devices of the owners and up to 15 guests, and six in house servants and five large equipment racks of gear (even amplifiers now are ip controlled) and that’s a shit ton of bandwidth. A normal home network would not function!
    Obviously I assume most folks don’t have those needs, but the infrastructure methodology is the same.

    So for a “typical” house (there is no such thing but for simplicity)
    - Best pipe (service) you can get. Preferably on fiber or Coax if possible.
    - Buy your own upgraded modem. For a couple hundred bucks that you’ll make up by not renting one.
    - Research and get best Router you can
    - Use strategic placement of WAPs over full cat 5 or better. Six is the norm, but we sometimes pull cat 7, 8, and/or fiber.
    This depends on how many floors, walls, building materials etc, square footage. Like much of this too much is better than not enough. Think brick shithouse from BITD...
    Usually the cat for your phones all homerun back to your headend or main distribution point. Depending on where that is and if there’s adequate power nearby, you can place all your gear there, or if possible, place a robust net switch there. Obviously for switch size you’ll need to figure out how many devices you’ll want to H.W. depending on how May wires you have. It’s usualky much easier to have at least enough Poe ports to power WAPs (make sure you’ll have enough wattage). You can find all kinds of wall trim to terminate similar to how your phone or net are trimmed on your walls, or if long enough wire just terminate RJ 45 etc. You’ll need to terminate all the ends at the net switch. A decent cable tester is a real help to ensure proper terminations. Inevitably you’ll need to test from end to end using all wires and splices/connections.
    So you have your service feed to your modem, a net cabl from modem to router, router to your switch or switches, and your WAPs hardwired to your switch (s). If done properly using good gear (find gear with specks way above what you think you need, it can be money well spent, remember, your trying to build a brick shithouse, not a cheap tent! ), you can make your network more robust, stable and therefore enjoyable! It’s like buying a car with a big engine, you don’t akways need it but when you do and you put the hammer down, you’ll be glad you have that headroom.
    Obviously many folks dont need so much, but even a additional switch with hardwired devices out of your provider modem can help when supply is getting stretched thin.
    No matter how big or small or what your needs are, always hardwire when possible! That’s what I’ve found works best, cause it’s all about the pipe!
    Hope this is understandable and helps. Sorry if I didn’t explain well.

  • Cousins Of The…
    Joined:
    8/13/75

    Jim, my first exposure to it was the Make Believe Ballroom LP on the TAKRL label

  • Gollum
    Joined:
    8/13/75

    in the queue...

  • JimInMD
    Joined:
    Hampton 87 & 8/13/75

    Made that run too.. I think there are several of us here that must have shared a fatty or a bowl at some point over the last 35 years.

    So are we doing One From the Vault next? My first tape of this was labeled "Make Believe Ballroom." Not sure where that came from or how common it was.

    So I decided if we are doing 3/24/90 I would re-order it and do it right.. which is where I still am. I did roast a good amount of kind Ethiopian Coffee and unfortunately spent a ton of time on the phone with USPS. Back to finally getting my Knick exactly perfect. Whoever mentioned the Mind Left Body.. my two favorites are 10/18/73 and 3/24/90. On the latter, Jerry and Brent are in the middle of a serious mind meld. It's amazing and Brent really does fill in the gaps, almost exactly perfectly. Always one of my favorite late era shows. Amazing.

  • bolo24
    Joined:
    8/13/75. "Good evening, we welcome you...

    ...On behalf of the group"

    Pretty much have this whole show memorized, as it's always in heavy rotation. What the heck, in the interest of supporting my Deadhead brethren, of all genders, races, political leanings and creeds, I'll cue it up tomorrow and play it LOUD on the big boy system!!

    Unless my wife is home, then it's headphones.

user picture

Member for

17 years 6 months
Bolo24 says: An Idea, Perhaps? Since we're all going to have a fair amount of spare time on our hands for the foreseeable future, what about starting another thread where we all listen to the same show/release on a given day and then share impressions afterward? Folks can submit suggestions and one person (not me) picks what we'll all listen to - call it Deadnet Picks or something. Anyway, if this idea is deemed to have merit, I'd suggest one of the loyal regular posters take the lead and do the picking - y'all can decide who. Might be fun. If it does go forward, I nominate Dick's Picks 18 for the first listen. Been talked about here lately, and, had it been a single show rather than a compilation, we'd probably be talking about it in the same conversation as Cornell, Veneta, etc. Or perhaps even Gainesville?? Stay safe and healthy, friends - this planet needs as many Deadheads as possible.
user picture

Member for

13 years 6 months
Permalink

Cool! This is a pick that I have not spun since its release. I am not a huge fan of 78 in general (though the July Box is great,) but I remember thinking that this one was better than I was expecting. Anyway, I am looking forward to diving in and giving it some fresh ears! If I recall, I preferred the 1st set to the 2nd on this one, but I'll reassess today.

BOLO - I threw my (most likely erroneous) hat in the ring and sent you a PM.

Peace

user picture

Member for

13 years 6 months
Permalink

I've never heard that before! That made a really nice warm-up for the day, making coffee, and watching the sun come out listen! Thank you! I especially loved the "Gomorrah" - what a gorgeous tune and what a great version!

Peace

GRATEFULGAL7277 - Thanks for suggesting Jerry's only solo acoustic show! I plan to give that a spin today for sure.

Bootleg notes.. A lone voice in the crowd shouts out "Maestro" and that about sums it up!

Supposedly Jerry was terrified and never did it again, the show fills a nice gap in a hot Spring '82 GD tour.. Bob & Jerry would play Letterman together 3 nights later. Love this stuff!

I'm with OTIS - '78 can run pretty hot or cold and the set lists tend to be a bit pedestrian, I don't think I gave this release a lot of attention, it probably got a listen and then I moved on to the next thing.

But from the sounds of the Opening Bertha > Good Lovin' through.. I'm up to Tennessee Jed, this sounds like a hot one! I think most of April is real good?!?

It's gonna be a good day to listen to the Dead!

PS - BOLO24 did you get my guess?
I tried to send a PM with my Fixable Foot Show Guess, being new at this participation thing and all, message system is kinda hooky... Can't tell if it got sent to you or not?

user picture

Member for

16 years 1 month
Permalink

Bertha> Good Love rocks, Candyman LLR was nice, rest of set 1 was just okay,

Lazy Supp. nice jam, Estimated>Eyes was nice, Drums into NFA love that, Wharf Rat Sugar Mag
OMSN blow out.

Nashville is a fine choice for a revisit, anniversary no less! Cool cover art also, psychedelic river boat and Wharf Rat. Anybody looking for an excellent paddlewheel side trip should take a listen to the album Mark Twang by the late great John Hartford. Gratefulgal - def will check out the solo Jerry show. I saw tail end of a Garcia & Kahn show a couple months later at Auditorium Theater in Chicago. Rowdy happy crowd. End of show, people yelling for Jerry to play Ripple. Then someone yells out loud and clear -"Play what you want!" Jerry looks up, says "Thank you!" and then plays Ripple! As to "Fixable Foot" - i got nothing Bolo.

I'm glad you enjoyed. I love the Gomorrah as well! I think the announcer saying "This is a rare musical experience" is very true for this show. Going Going Gone is also hauntingly beautiful.

user picture

Member for

17 years 4 months

In reply to by gr8fulgal77

Permalink

....i provided two guesses. Both wrong. I have no idea.
Working today, so unable to listen to the physical Nashville, so firing up a Miller SB of the Archive.

user picture

Member for

8 years 11 months

In reply to by gr8fulgal77

Permalink

Rare Musical Experience indeed!

I think that's John Scher (promoter) doin' that introduction.

There's a couple of videos of Rubin & Cherise (Spelling seems to be subjective) & Ripple floating around on the interwebs.. They'll definitely bring a smile to your face.

Jerry!

I wonder if the whole set / both sets video is out there somewhere?

I'm diggin' this! Thanks for the tip..

user picture

Member for

13 years 6 months
Permalink

I sent a reply to your PM - I hope that it went through this time. I don't know what happened to the first one.

Peace

user picture

Member for

4 years 7 months

In reply to by The Good Ole G…

Permalink

Thank you so much! So cool to see Jerry playing! That song is one of my favs from that set so that was a real treat!

user picture

Member for

4 years 7 months

In reply to by gr8fulgal77

Permalink

I sent my answer in last night! I can't wait to see what show it is, such an interesting hint!

user picture

Member for

8 years 10 months

In reply to by gr8fulgal77

Permalink

Synchronicity

Thanks for the mention > triggered some research > stumbled on video > had to share.

Love that song too, and haven't heard this show in years and years.. so good!

user picture

Member for

8 years 10 months

In reply to by Vguy72

Permalink

Yay Work! The economy needs you.

Let us know what you listen too.. maybe we'll join you.

Not working & shit, but in spirit you know?

BTW Miller has been dropping some nice Don Pearson Cassette Master Upgrades lately... there's some freshies out there! Especially if you like 1989, 90 & 91... 9/26/91 comes to mind.. I know that run gets pretty panned by history and in McNally's book, but I dug that show the other day... for '91 sounded pretty sweet.

Best wishes.

user picture

Member for

4 years 7 months
Permalink

I sent my guess to your inbox. This is my first time sending a message, so I hope I did it correctly.

user picture

Member for

16 years 1 month
Permalink

Me too, Looks like PM aren't working.

user picture

Member for

13 years 6 months
Permalink

Rocking Bertha>Good Lovin! Very nice Candyman (what a great song! This version is stellar.) Donna sounding great on LLR. Tenn Jed - why so sllllooooowwww? It is such a great tune, but at this pace, it is a bit of a bore. Jack Straw is pretty standard, Peggy-O is always welcome, and this one is pretty good- Jerry's singing is solid. Minglewood is high-energy, rock-star Weir, and Deal closes things out nicely. Overall, I enjoyed it... It does get dragged down in the middle of the set with Tenn Jed serving as the the third "slow" tune in a row, then followed by an average Jack Straw and another slow tune Peggy-O. Miglewood and Deal bring the energy back up, but neither are "must-hear" versions, IMO. Overall, a solid 7/10.

"That's it, we quit." Sounded like Bob was actually kinda pissed!

Now onto Set II...

Peace

user picture

Member for

13 years 6 months
Permalink

I received a PM from Bolo saying that he did not get my original, so it looks like PMs are working (at least in some capacity.)

I replied to his PM, but have yet to hear anything. I think my problem was that the site didn't recognize that I had sent the message to Bolo. The original is in my Messages folder, but I am the only recipient. I know that I typed his username into the "To:" portion, but for some reason, it didn't register.

Peace

user picture

Member for

16 years 1 month
Permalink

In honor of our newest release, do to ship in a week may I suggest
a trip to June '74 with Dick's Picks Vol 12. 6/26 - 6/28 1974.

user picture

Member for

8 years 11 months

In reply to by bolo24

Permalink

PM Resent, this one includes you on the thread.. so I think it worked.

LMK and Thanks!
Best,
The GOGD

user picture

Member for

8 years 10 months

In reply to by fourwindsblow

Permalink

I like the idea of some '74 pre-partying.

user picture

Member for

15 years
Permalink

Have now received the missing messages.

No winner yet, although That's Otis was on the right track - he just needed to try a "little bit harder, just a little bit more, a little bit further than he gone before."

EDIT: No, "The Wheel" isn't in the setlist.

user picture

Member for

8 years 10 months

In reply to by bolo24

Permalink

Thanks Bolo24!

Dang it.. I knew my attempt was weak 😬 🌹⚡️🌈

user picture

Member for

15 years
Permalink

Garcia's solos on virtually every song of that JGB 91 release were immaculate. Whether slow, fast, bluesy or funky, each song was performed darn near flawlessly. Melvin and David were beasts on their respective instruments, with the ladies adding beauty to the vocal palette. A great latter-day release!

user picture

Member for

17 years 5 months
Permalink

Had not listened to this show in a long time. Also on my iPod . Lazy Lightning - Supplication was exciting.
Happy Earth Day 50 today. Was at Central Park bandshell for first Earth Day celebration 50 years ago when I 16. Saw the Jefferson Airplane play a free concert a few weeks later at the same venue.

user picture

Member for

13 years 6 months

In reply to by bolo24

Permalink

Hiya Bolo! Sent another PM your way... (fingers crossed!)

Set II for today's listen has been delayed (how is it that I seemingly have more work when I am not at work?!?) Anyway, about to walk the pups and start dinner. Set II will have to be my cooking jams for the night :)

Peace

user picture

Member for

8 years 1 month

In reply to by Strider 808808

Permalink

Dave's Picks #15. One more Saturday night in Nashville. Damn right! Like Otis and Strider, I don't listen to this one often, but I should. I usually pull 4/24/78, Dave's #7.
But this wonderful exercise is forcing me to listen to these shows again in full.

Nice first set, yes Otis, that New Minglewood blues really rocks. Bob definitely kicked it up a notch on this one.
I have to say I really like Deal, however, this version and other 78 versions with Donna's high pitch squeal of Deal, just makes me want to turn it off. Sounds like yodeling.
Second set is sweet, great start and I like the Estimated, but Jerry kind of wanders a bit in these 78 versions. Really good Eyes, love the Wharf Rat and great finish with Sugar Magnolia and One More Saturday Night.

These picks have been fun for me people. Thanks!

I think Conekid maybe had some suggestions for next picks? I have a few more as well, but I will wait until others get some more in.

Oh, one more thing, I believe we will be getting another early April 78 release soon.

Be well folks!

Edit, sorry I didn't see Dicks #12. Rats, another one I don't have.

user picture

Member for

15 years
Permalink

At this point, it's fairly apparent that the odds of someone solving this riddle based on the sole clue provided are pretty low. On a positive note, some of the guesses have been quite clever and somewhat entertaining!

So, below you'll find a further (furthur?) clue. A consolation prize will go to the first accurate guess. I'll save the better goodies for a future giveaway. Again, show your work, one guess per screen name.

Here it is:

2 word anagram, no leftover letters.

Good luck!

user picture

Member for

16 years 1 month
Permalink

"guesses have been quite clever and somewhat entertaining!"

Bolo, I bet you pissed your pants when you saw my answer.

user picture

Member for

17 years 4 months

In reply to by fourwindsblow

Permalink

....holee shit Garcia! Tell us how you really feel!! As Jim Carrey said in The Mask, "Smokin!!"

user picture

Member for

17 years
Permalink

I'm still trying to figure out Liberace on a ostrich running in a garbage dump in Virginia from last year... I guess i need easier clues, like Alpine Valley is in this state!!! Just kidding... bob t

user picture

Member for

9 years 1 month

In reply to by DeadVikes

Permalink

Yeah Deadvikes, the pick I was holding on to is 8-13-75. I was looking for a reason to listen to the vinyl copy I have.
But we don’t have to listen to it this week.
Alternatively, maybe we need to throw in a more modern show at this stage of the game. Say, something with Bruce?
Maybe spiced up with some Branford in honor of his father being taken by Covid?
9-10-91 for tomorrow?

user picture

Member for

17 years 4 months

In reply to by bob t

Permalink

....what was up with that clue last year involving Liberace??
EDIT. 9.10.91 for Thursday? Okee-dokey. I'm easy to please.

user picture

Member for

17 years
Permalink

Milton the Toaster was a spokesman! Just kidding i have not even come close to guessing a riddle of yours.... be safe everyone... bob t

Well..... That narrows it down.

Narrows it down to what show?
I, for one, do not know.

user picture

Member for

13 years 5 months

In reply to by icecrmcnkd

Permalink

I can think of at least six shows that fit this bill. The US Festival in 82.. a few Fillmore East shows, Sunsplash '82 and of course the Closing of Winterland just to name a few. None of them contain fixable feet anagrams though.

I think all the clues are carefully documented if you take a magnifying glass and do a deep dive on Blotter Art. That's all I've got. Be safe all.

http://www.key-z.com/special.html

user picture

Member for

8 years 1 month

In reply to by DeadVikes

Permalink

So, as the whole family is extremely fortunate and working from home and going to school, my 11 year had a very asoute observation. I have been working in our basement and playing a ton of GD. I don't do the headphones due to fear of hearing issues (yes, might be old lame reasoning). "Your music is so loud and annoying." Of course I said, "No it is not and if it was why do you always dance every time you hear it and sing along?"

"I don't like it, it is just stuck in my head."

For AJS and Carlo, Jerry! Jerry Garcia!

user picture

Member for

16 years 1 month
Permalink

Grateful Dead music is highly infectious before you no it you can have symptoms like singing out loud dancing around collecting massive amounts of live shows.

ps. 6/28/74 To Lay Me Down last Jam almost blew my walls out.

user picture

Member for

9 years 1 month

In reply to by fourwindsblow

Permalink

About to fire it up.

Deadvikes, don’t let those kids push you around.

user picture

Member for

17 years 4 months

In reply to by icecrmcnkd

Permalink

https://archive.org/details/gd1991-09-10.mtx.amdig.gems.98132.flac16/gd…
....just started. At work again today, so i will be pausing it here and there, but I'll make in though.
On a side note, the mayor of Las Vegas embarrassed the shit out of herself and our city during an interview on CNN yesterday. Holy cow. I just put both my hands in my head and shook it. Technically, i live in Henderson, so she's not MY mayor. Lol.
Avatar changed accordingly for todays listen.

user picture

Member for

8 years 11 months

In reply to by icecrmcnkd

Permalink

Hey there!

I've enjoyed reading the back and forth and tripping through these live Dead picks. It's like a smorgasbord:)

Follow Up on Yesterdays listening & comments:
4/22/78 - I agree with everything you all been laying down in regards to that pick and don't have anything better to add, nice work! It was fun to dust it off.. I think it might get dusty again.

4/10/82 - Jerry Acoustic, man is that a treat! Both sets, so intimate and special, flawed and personal. Kinda like the maestro himself a multi-faceted jewel.

I took a detour along the route to today and I'd highly recommend it -
4/22/77 - What a killer show!

After tripping through June '76 box set & DiP V20 - 9/25 & 9/28/76 followed by DaP V15 - 4/22/78 this show lands right in the middle and gives them a run for their money.

The 1st show of the legendary Spring Tour, an AMAZING 20 minute PITB to close Set 1, The 2nd ever FOTM, 1st ever Mojo. It's definitely worth the trip. And... it's so cool to hear the difference between 1976 & 1978. Ever changing ever evolving. It's the same band, but it's not. Check out the solo in IMHBTR (playing right now), wow Good Stuff! The launching point for some of their most legendary shows that will follow in the next coming weeks. This show feels like it's a bit off the radar, can't remember really settling into it before, probably collected in a fever to get everything and.... well check it out!

Alright, sounds like today is packed with more good listening suggestions -
1991-09-10 - 30 Trips
1974-06-26 & 1974-06-28 - DiP V12

I've got my work cut out for me, but I'm hip to the challenge.

Be Well you all and keep the good times rolling!