• 8,084 replies
    marye
    Joined:
    Bolo24 says: An Idea, Perhaps? Since we're all going to have a fair amount of spare time on our hands for the foreseeable future, what about starting another thread where we all listen to the same show/release on a given day and then share impressions afterward? Folks can submit suggestions and one person (not me) picks what we'll all listen to - call it Deadnet Picks or something. Anyway, if this idea is deemed to have merit, I'd suggest one of the loyal regular posters take the lead and do the picking - y'all can decide who. Might be fun. If it does go forward, I nominate Dick's Picks 18 for the first listen. Been talked about here lately, and, had it been a single show rather than a compilation, we'd probably be talking about it in the same conversation as Cornell, Veneta, etc. Or perhaps even Gainesville?? Stay safe and healthy, friends - this planet needs as many Deadheads as possible.

Comments

sort by
Recent
Reset
  • Oroborous
    Joined:
    2/20/71

    Another fine show but it didn’t quite...? It seemed just a pinch....less? Words aren’t working, it’s a feeling...maybe I was influenced by Bobs opening Hangover comments, cause that’s how it felt (projecting my own experiences); they killed it the night before, now settled in after two big shows, breaking out 7 new tunes, whilst dealing with inter organizational turmoil, it’s Friday night, their in NY, after the big show they relax a tad and blow off steam, perhaps a lot of steam, only to find themselves right back up there before ya know it in a mere few hours and well, time to go to work boys!
    It’s subtle, but they seem to have to ease into it slightly, versus turbo charged on all cylinders out the gate?
    They start out ok, but the first part of the first set their not quite there yet, good, but not great; a little slop, more tuning issues I.e., Bob in Loser...Bertha and Playin perhaps sound more like new songs then the first two versions. Hard to Handle, similarly to 2/18 is again good, but not quite the preacher come to meetin’ fire and brimstone compared to say some 70 versions?
    But by Bird Song they seem to be settling in, like after that first drink/joint and a few tunes under the belt, and away we go. Big Boss then into a nice Cryptical suite, if not the big launchpad it would become, a good rendition of the times I.e., Skull Fuck etc, and they seem to have shook off the cob webs. Another good rookie outing of the Rat, followed by a nice Maggy closer. In some ways I like these Sugar Mags not being the full drawn out beast it could become. They have that more country flavor and like many of these songs, that sorta short and sweet vibe. Like Doc says of these early Bird Songs.
    I guess I’d call the second set “status quo”, not in a bad way, just typical songs, played according to the times.
    Perhaps some of my feelings about this are situational? Though i might of been influenced by the drop in audio quality from those first two official releases with all that voodoo, I did listen to most of this on the big system versus the first 2 we’re mostly on the lesser living room zone.
    Not sure why it’s nagging me to come up with “words” but I can’t, just a feeling. A good show, but I’d take the bling and set list of the first night, and 2/19 overall, so far...
    This is where doing the whole run comes in. If I hadn’t moved in order, I might have felt different about this one, so I’m sure much of my “feeling” was influenced by the previous two...
    2/21/71: back to the multitrack full treatment goodness!
    Onward!

  • Strider 808808
    Joined:
    2/20/71

    It was as high energy as I remember being there. I do remember during the end of the New Riders set while they were playing Honky Tonk Woman the crowd was going wild, Bob Weir, Pigpen and Veronica Barnard ( Pigs girlfriend) stood backstage on the right side checking out scene. Bobby was shaking his head in the affirmative. The balcony used to shake during the more rocking songs. 2/21/71 tonight.

  • JimInMD
    Joined:
    Re:

    Much like George Foreman.. all my kids (and turtles) are named Charlie Miller.

  • bob t
    Joined:
    Capitol Theatre- How cool does Phil's bass sound

    That's all. Bob t

  • Vguy72
    Joined:
    2.20 relisten options....

    ... I just closed my eyes and picked one.
    Shall we go??

  • Oroborous
    Joined:
    Miller High Life

    Both seem ok? I listened to parts of Loser from all four, think the fourth is better than the first, and the third is better still, but the levels are low so I’m going with the Miller. It seems to breath a bit more in the High end like you said, more clear/transparent, the ole difference between a clean window and a dirty window...I.e., you can hear the crowd trying to clap along at the start of Loser better...though the Miller does have some artifacts, but as you say it hsas the Mark just as plain as day, so will hedge our proverbial bets on that horse!
    Sounds like somebodies still hungover LOL

  • The Good Ole G…
    Joined:
    What's Become Of The Betty's

    Speculating:
    To my ears the 2006 Betty's circulating sound like some Dolby application happened (says Dolby A)
    the 2011 CM doesn't mention any Dolby info.
    Possibly same original source just different transfers.
    Charlie would know for sure ;)

    EDIT: Could be a personal pref thing, comparably they both sound good. I'm not sure I have the pro jargon for what I'm hearing. But I guess I would say, Miller has more high end / dynamics. But curious how would you describe it?

    EDIT2: Now I'm worm holing, but almost sounds like the 2006 is close to clipping as well and potentially a pitch correction needed. Now I'm really curious to hear what you hear ;)

  • Oroborous
    Joined:
    GOGD

    What’s up with those 7” Beatty reels?

  • The Good Ole G…
    Joined:
    It's Miller Time

    OB - 116617

    I haven't compared, but ol CM is the modern day Trade Mark of Quality IMO.

  • Oroborous
    Joined:
    2/20 Source

    Curious what source y’all going with?
    I see four on Relisten, they all sound in the same ballpark..

user picture

Member for

17 years 5 months
Bolo24 says: An Idea, Perhaps? Since we're all going to have a fair amount of spare time on our hands for the foreseeable future, what about starting another thread where we all listen to the same show/release on a given day and then share impressions afterward? Folks can submit suggestions and one person (not me) picks what we'll all listen to - call it Deadnet Picks or something. Anyway, if this idea is deemed to have merit, I'd suggest one of the loyal regular posters take the lead and do the picking - y'all can decide who. Might be fun. If it does go forward, I nominate Dick's Picks 18 for the first listen. Been talked about here lately, and, had it been a single show rather than a compilation, we'd probably be talking about it in the same conversation as Cornell, Veneta, etc. Or perhaps even Gainesville?? Stay safe and healthy, friends - this planet needs as many Deadheads as possible.
user picture

Member for

8 years

In reply to by bluecrow

Permalink

Alright, Firstshow, I will get 8/12/79 going today. 79, so many fantastic shows! Would love a box.

user picture

Member for

10 years 2 months
Permalink

Started on the Menke aud. which seemed the best but all the auds. had their issues. Got to the break between the first two songs and someone whistled right next to the mike. Found the fifth one was labelled soundboard and is great but a tad fast comparatively. Brent is up front in the mix! Can hear the banter between songs too. Woo-hoos from the band after Promised Land, lol.
We were in prime seats with a great view of that new guy with the long hair.
Cheers

user picture

Member for

10 years 2 months
Permalink

Cannot believe I did not ever listen to this amazingly good show. I knew from memory that it was a good one but now I'm putting it in the top tier. The it factor has to be the Estimated > Eyes > Drums > Space > NFA > Black Peter. That is so release worthy. The fast tempo 20 minute Eyes is firing on all cylinders and the NFA with the long jazzy funky intro is one of the best. All on a crisp SB. 1st set does not disappoint either. Cassette master but I'll bet the speed issue was during transfer later. Will say more later if it will let me.
Cheers

user picture

Member for

10 years 2 months
Permalink

And there is an exclamation point after them all! Brent fits in so well and doesn't even grab a solo until Estimated where he shows his stuff. Just subtly nailing everything, you wouldn't think he's the new guy. The China > Rider to start 2nd set is rough and ready! I bet if I had headphones on I could hear Mickey inviting the crew to play some bells in the middle of the second half of the thundering Drums > hand Drums. And the Eyes fades into a jam then almost a pre-drums Space. It's the rug that ties the room together Dude. I'll bet the drummers loved playing with and in The Rocks themselves.
Cheers

user picture

Member for

10 years 1 month
Permalink

Got to do something as Marye seems powerless to do anything about this major screw-up!
Cheers anyway
1-9-24 edit: Marye says they are working on it (on 48 thread).

user picture

Member for

17 years 4 months

In reply to by JimInMD

Permalink

But what’d you eat yesterday lol

Tried to post more, but, ya know…

Anyone have a pick out there?

Might have to explore some 91

Wish they would release last year's MUATM show from Solider Field in 91. Fantastic show and a great watch. I remember sitting in the theater and 80% of the crowd left before the encore. I mentioned to some of them there is one song left.

Be well out there.

user picture

Member for

17 years 4 months

In reply to by DeadVikes

Permalink

On new music, both a pile of jazz from Santa, and a huge pile of dead from our own DN personal Santa ; )
So I’ve recently hit DaP 14&15, To Terrapin, DL 1, DL 12, after hitting first 79 shows through the 15th

Yeah, don’t understand why they wouldn’t release that and 7/2/89 as they must have done all the production work? I still haven’t seen the 91…

user picture

Member for

11 years 7 months

In reply to by Oroborous

Permalink

Oro, tell us your last five new jazz, inquiring minds and all that. Been away from music, visiting family and friends, holiday travel delayed because everyone was catching covid (again). New batch of CDs on the way, just listened solo piano jazz: Fred Hersch, Alone at the Vanguard. Hersch is great, however introspective/reflective, on the quiet side. Ari does Jerry, I waited to see if anyone else posted that on a certain cable network show last night at 6 pm eastern, host Ari did a spot about the weather, showed a photo of Jerry playing Alligator and used the Cold Rain and Snow as a headliner, so to speak. He's usually all over Rap and HipHop stuff, so to see Jerry, well yeah!

user picture

Member for

13 years 4 months

In reply to by DeadVikes

Permalink

I wish they'd release that also. The closest Meet Up At the Movies is hours from where I live and I can rarely make it.

Oh well. Enjoyed the Red Rocks 79 show, a few days late and many dollars short, but I made it. Perhaps I'll fit in June 91 Soldier Field too.

No Hey Now. Getting this post through is giving me a little survivors guilt. Rock on. They're playing the Duke University Fall 78 show on Sirius XM right now. That one's gonna get released one day. There's video too somewhere, Jerry giving a helping hand with drums and practically break dancing on US Blues.... About the happiest you will see him playing. Animated Jerry.

user picture

Member for

10 years 2 months
Permalink

Does cite GD lyrics from time to time.
I was walking by the TV and saw that last night. A wait, what doubletake.
Cheers

Jazz? Check out Scofield doing UJB on GD Hour filler this week.

user picture

Member for

11 years 7 months

In reply to by 1stshow70878

Permalink

indeed that's on my list. Sco fan. Resisted for a while but have been diving in to Matteo Mancuso's stuff, before I have to burn my guitars in shame. Looking forward to a couple local performances coming up of the Vermont Mandolin Trio, Matt Flinner, Will Patton and Jamie Masefield. Matt joined Mr. Sun last month for their Nutcracker show at Chandler, fantastic on banjo and mandolin, Jamie founded the Jazz Mandolin Project up in Burlington in the early 90s with drummer Gabe Jarrett, son of Keith.

user picture

Member for

17 years 4 months

In reply to by dmcvt

Permalink

Live at Tonic CM band
Amad Jamal At the Pershing…
Chic Corea Now He Sings…
Kenny Burrell Midnight Blue
Michael Breaker Tales of the Hudson
George Benson Essential
Pat M Day Trip
MJQ 4 classic albums
Charlie Christian collection
Bird with Strings
MD Round About Midnight
Red Garland 4 classic albums

Think that’s this years batch?

user picture

Member for

17 years 4 months

In reply to by Oroborous

Permalink

Sounds perfect, will check it?
Been thinking bout that Sco, but good for now lol.
Imagine you have the David Murray?

Today
DL 12, again lol
9/3&4/80

EDIT: MUATM, never been, also too far..luckily saw most during the Shakedown Stream summer Covid party! But not Chi 91 : (

user picture

Member for

17 years 4 months

In reply to by Oroborous

Permalink

Like the Fox shows and Huntington perhaps even better!
That whole tour rocks and would make a sweet BB box!

user picture

Member for

11 years 7 months

In reply to by Oroborous

Permalink

Good stuff Oro! Maybe said before, when in high school, late 60s, listening to the Stones, the Dead, JA, MC-5, Led Zep, Hendrix etc, a friend convinced me to listen to jazz I had never heard before. Yep, knew a little Miles and Coltrane, Dizzy G, Eddie Harris, The Meters but he spun for me Chick's Now He Sings and Keith Jarrett's Somewhere Before which opened up my ears more, made me a fan of great jazz piano. Fred Hersch has a lot of stuff out there, a good starter with Bill Frisell, Songs We Know. Also a fan of McCoy Tyner, Kenny Barron, Paul Bley.

user picture

Member for

17 years 4 months

In reply to by dmcvt

Permalink

RT 2-1 MSG 90
Checked it out tonight, good sheet Mon!

DMCVT: used to be more a bop and fusion fan.
Usual suspects etc
Just getting mellow in old age I guess lol
Piano jazz is relatively new thang, Bill Evans currently da shite, but so much to choose from. Really, I’m just getting going into jazz. Always dug it, but never dug in. The older I get, the more I dig instrumental music. Think that’s part of it?

user picture

Member for

8 years

In reply to by Oroborous

Permalink

Decided to listen to most of this show today. Really good recording from Pearson Healy and Miller with the transfer. Fun show. 91 has a such a different feel and I really like it. Need to be in the mood for it. I often think why the hell did I not make it to any shows in 91 you dumbass.

The 90 MSG mix from RT2.1. Another good release here OB. Tomorrow I will get it going. I seem to recall the bonus disc from this release is very good as well.
I say release all the MUATM shows. Why not.

Edit: Funny OB, I listened to the DL 7 shows from September 1980 on Monday. Really good show(s)!

user picture

Member for

13 years 4 months

In reply to by DeadVikes

Permalink

Right you are, Oro.. in my mind I had Duke Univ. pegged for the fall but when I saw Huntington and other fall shows I had to look it up, April 12th.

91 - There's some great chemistry in different places in 91. I really like the Dicks Picks (17) from that year. They played the Eyes of the world from the filler 3/31 (Greensboro NC) last night. Great filler from Hornsby and they get a nice sublime groove underneath it all.

Ari does seem to pull out a GD Rap with little effort. I'm amazed at how common subtle GD references have become. It's good to see so any different people still dropping the GD on us when we least expect it.

user picture

Member for

10 years 2 months
Permalink

A taste on Jam-o-week.
4-18-78; Nice Sugaree.
Cheers

Edit: Isn't this the part we missed on the filler on DaP 37 W. & M. ? Sweet!

user picture

Member for

8 years

In reply to by 1stshow70878

Permalink

This is a good release. Love the jams out of Let it Grow and Foolish Heart. To lay me down, Eyes, Estimated and Foolish Heart leave me wanted more from this release. I think they started gelling more in 91 than their first shows without Brent in fall of 1990. However, I haven't listened to much fall 90 other than the shows and complications released. I will have to take a look at some more shows from this time period.

user picture

Member for

9 years

In reply to by DeadVikes

Permalink

4-16-78 betty board.anon.noel
playing now.

Sounds a lot better than the cassette I had years ago.

Also got a copy of 4-14-78 betty board.anon.noel loaded on the music player. Don’t think that I’ve ever heard that show.

user picture

Member for

8 years

In reply to by icecrmcnkd

Permalink

Looking at 7/10/89 from the wonderful Giants Stadium Box set. Of the two 89 shows in this box, I haven't listened to this one very much. I tend to typically go with 7/9 with that Shakedown opener and the Birdsong to close out the first set.

Time to get it going.

user picture

Member for

17 years 4 months

In reply to by DeadVikes

Permalink

Next day or two…
Still cruising early 79 with my big 45th mañana!!!
My do somethin er, special ; ) where does the time go!

And, of course, other extracurricular activities to attend to also this WE, but, shhhh, don’t wanna jinx anything…

I wish I was still 45, but that ship set sail long ago lol
But thanks for the kind salutation!
My first Dead show was 45 years ago tonight!
What a long strange trip it still is!

EDIT: I was 45 when my avatar picture was taken ; )

user picture

Member for

8 years

In reply to by Oroborous

Permalink

Happy 45th Anniversary OB. Shea's Buffalo Theater. Would love a recap. The tall end of the Keith and Donna era. Must have been a blast.

On a side note, I love Dave's enthusiasm, but there are currently four Dave's Picks for sale. I don't think I have ever seen that.

Go Bills!

user picture

Member for

17 years 4 months

In reply to by DeadVikes

Permalink

Mamma mamma many worlds I’ve come…
I somewhat documented it on the show page. I won’t bother trying here, cause, ya know ; )

Hope Dave’s not just doing the Dave!

🤞nervous wreck about the other…

user picture

Member for

11 years 3 months

In reply to by DeadVikes

Permalink

I'm on that Buffalo show!
There's a beautiful Jerry Moore recording on the archive.
Very clean sound!

Edit: Donna is absent from this show.

user picture

Member for

10 years 2 months
Permalink

That Moore is a good tape! Says Sony TC-D5M recorder with mikes way up high in 6th row. Serendipitously I just looked at some decks from a high priced vendor and a restored one of those Sonys was like $700 to $1900! Say what? Are they that good? It ain't a Nak.
Cheers
Edit: Nice set list! And it has a Dark Star!?!
Edit 2: Nice write up ORO! I'm always surprised by how many comments are "first show". Hey, we're all at the same show today, lol. Pass me that jib.

user picture

Member for

17 years 4 months

In reply to by 1stshow70878

Permalink

Trying to remember lol
It is a great aud!
Shows unusual, which to me makes it nice.

Yeah man, that January tenth show could easily be edited to under three an a quarter hours, which would leave just enough time for a nice slice of January twenty say from that groovy Serengeti drum jam through maybe NFA. Make a cool DaP, Of course that’s if there’s tapes, which word on the street is nadda : (
Hey, a girl can dream ; )

Nice to see folks hangin round!

user picture

Member for

7 years 9 months
Permalink

I'm really partial to that Shea's show! I think there are several factors in play for me, including it being an early tape in my collection (I only had set II) of a really good audience recording. I enjoyed the timbre, the feel of the room. I know today it looks like a standard set list if you discount the DS but back then I didn't know differently. And I was really familiar with 12/31/78, so this night just felt on a continuum since I didn't know anything about band internal dynamics etc. Oroborous' review (thank you for typing that all up!!) was lovely to read. This afternoon I have been listening to 1/7/78 - one of the laryngitis shows in San Diego, and the night before the 'Uncle Bobo' show - but afterwards I think it's time to jump ahead a year to this night in Buffalo.

user picture

Member for

7 years 9 months
Permalink

I'm not sure if there's a better to place to put this - and I've been ludicrously busy at work all month, so maybe this has already been discussed elsewhere - but is there a thread or discussion of Dave's recent 'Spend a Little Time on the Mountain with Dave Lemieux' YT video?

"And then I won't give anything away, but #51, I've been working very closely with Jeffrey Norman the last few weeks on #51... of course it's a complete show... there was a little bit of extra room, and we are rounding it out with music from a show that we released awhile ago... a couple picks ago... that wasn't complete because there wasn't room. [...] So if you want to finish off another complete show that was part of the Dave's Picks series, I won't tell you what show it was, what pick it was, no hints... but it will complete that show as well."

So surely that must be the rest of 10/24/70 St. Louis. But, does that imply we're going to get a Pigpen (and perhaps T.C.) release for Volume 51!?! I'd love to think so, esp after Dave all but said Vol 51 won't be a Keith nor a Brent era show. But I guess the presence of some 1970 filler doesn't guarantee that the 'main entree' will be from a similar year; after all, Dave's Vol 44 is a 1990 show that has that Cold Rain & Snow filler from December 1969...

user picture

Member for

17 years 4 months

In reply to by 1stshow70878

Permalink

1/20/79: bit of a creeper. Bobs strong throughout, JG hit and miss for a bit, eventually comes around. Perhaps freaked out by whatever went down…
Beginning of second sorta status quo, the rest, sublime trippy goodness!

1/21/79: mediocre aud, good energy though! True professional road warriors just push on through the adversity and git er done!

7/10/89: good call DV. I usually go with the Shakedown too, so it was nice to hit this one. Needed a good stranger. Always enjoy a nice Little Light. You can hear Jerry smiling during Foolish Heart. (He’s singing, but you can tell he’s smiling) Forgot about the fun train wreck ending in Masterpiece. Man those 89s sound so good!
Release the Multis! Fall 89 baby!

And yeah conekid, those are good, I like theFox shows even better!
another trove of ridiculous sources just sitting there going to waste!
Release the Beatty’s! Spring 78 baby!

Also,
Primal Dead 66-70
Summer 85
Fall 91
First six of 73
Summer 76

OBEAH: ditto on 51

user picture

Member for

8 years

In reply to by Oroborous

Permalink

Nice work OB. Yes, I enjoyed this show as well. Not your uncle's Franklin's, but still good. Good Jack a Row. Nice Foolish Heart second set opener, good Playing UJB. I was surprised to hear the Iko Iko out of Space and I thought who else is singing here. Oh yes, the Nevilles came out after Space. Totally forgot about this. Good Watchtower, which I really liked in the late 80s. We get a great Dew, Sugar Mag, KOHD.

I think we have all the July 89 shows released with the exception of the Alpine shows, Deer Creek and Foxoboro. Let's get those out.

I will check out those 79 audience recordings OB.

user picture

Member for

8 years

In reply to by DeadVikes

Permalink

I need a little summer 71. RT1.3 rolling. A lot of raw energy on this one.

Sorry about the Bills OB. They definitely had their chances.

user picture

Member for

17 years 4 months

In reply to by DeadVikes

Permalink

They certainly did…beat themselves Bills did it again.
I’m not talking the kick either, that game never should have gotten to that.
But, ce la vi

I’ll fire that up after I’m done with February 89.
Quite the difference from early 79 which I finished yesterday.

user picture

Member for

17 years 4 months

In reply to by Oroborous

Permalink

Where’s Waldo, er a, I mean Jimbo?
Know he’s scheduled for some slicing and dicing next month, but getting worried since we haven’t seen hide nor hair in too long.

EDIT: boggles my mind why they wouldn’t drop 7/2/89 since they did something ? to it for MUATM? Deer Creeks awight, but I wouldn’t rush on it.
We know fall is sweet, but I’ve not explored early 89 yet. So far, solid…

user picture

Member for

13 years 4 months

In reply to by Oroborous

Permalink

I have tried to post several times but denied by the Hey Now police.

Looks like we lost Mr. Ones for the same reason.

Hey Now dead net.. the Cone of Silence you installed here is not working properly.

What? Hey Now, I can't hear you. What? Himey, kill the lights.

user picture

Member for

13 years 4 months

In reply to by JimInMD

Permalink

I cannot seem to discuss the weather without getting hey nowed.

We did get at least a foot and a half of light fluffy snow in the mountains here the last couple weeks which explains my absence. Busted arm and all, I did manage to fit in days of downhill and back country skiing with friends and family. Don't tell my mom or my orthopedic surgeon. The hills of WV are exquisite with a couple feet of soft fluffy powder. Unfortunately, it gets harder as you older. By yesterday morning I could barely move, my teenage son on the other hand just can't get enough snow fun. What are you supposed to do when the kids get better than the teachers? Grounding? Chain them in the basement until they understand humility. It's humbling trying to keep up with the kiddies.

I had written a much better description, but something about the weather or the mere mention of Fred Sanford clutching his heart gasping for breath got me hey nowed...

Been listening to a bit of 71, 72, 74, 89 and some Jerry Garcia Band as a palate cleanser. Last month I did a deep dive into the MSG box, the last couple weeks the Giants Box got hit. Both good but the Giants Box seems to be a step above. I keep coming back to the 81 shows in the Garden box, there's something extra there, that China Rider smokes.

user picture

Member for

17 years 4 months

In reply to by JimInMD

Permalink

It’s Grady!

Yes many a man’s done a terrible thing, just to bash endless days of pow pow, sigh. Used to be me, but alas, the old bodinski can’t handle it anymore, for as you say: bashing the pow IS hard work!

Glad your ok and digging it in spite of other complications etc!

Yass, need to hit 81 and 82 of MSG, did 83 recently.
89 baby! It’s always been a top one for moi, but gonna dig deep this year!

user picture

Member for

8 years

In reply to by Oroborous

Permalink

Any February 89 recommendations OB?

Love that MSG Box Jim. It is so different than all the others. Looking forward to whatever this year's box will be. A good amount of snow out East, we have none now.

So many good shows in 71. Enjoyed RT1.3 today.

Be well people. Hey Bluecrow!

user picture

Member for

9 years 1 month

In reply to by DeadVikes

Permalink

doing alright here in my cave up in the hills (everything else i wrote got the H-N treatment) Boooooo.

I'll be back : )

user picture

Member for

9 years 1 month

In reply to by bluecrow

Permalink

i've always loved that RT 1.3, esp Yale Bowl