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    marye
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    New year, new update. Tell us of your musical adventures in real time!

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  • Oroborous
    Joined:
    The sound

    Of thick air...

  • uncle_tripel
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    always...

    ...avoided the NR on recording
    and found very early the highs just got too muted for my ear,

    returning to some more 1978 this week:
    june 4th 1978
    at Campus Stadium, UCSB in Santa Barbara, Ca

    some more friends of the devils? lol...
    ...= the "on stage" harley davidson acceleration into--->NFA

    make LOVE, not war!

    PEACE!
    uncle_tripel

    PS: new avatar = mickey & jerry on 7/4/86 @ Rich Stadium

  • JimInMD
    Joined:
    Noise Reduction and...

    I used Dolby for a brief blink of an eye when I first started copying tapes. Being young and naive, I thought who wants tape noise to come through on the recording, duh.. no brainer, I flipped the Dolby switch on my Nak and hit record. I just want to hear the music, no hiss.

    Very quickly reality set in. Was it Dolby A or Dolby B? Was the source tape recording using Dolby, if so, if you hit Dolby wouldn't it further compress the recording and further alter the sound, you can't play back using Dolby Squared, right? And what do you do in the car, in the boom box (yes.. we were just a few years out of 8 tracks when I started getting tapes). And who really flips or unflips the Dolby switch anyway based on how you think the recording was made. After all, were all these tapes properly notated every step of the way.

    So I quickly gave up on noise reduction, I had a good enough tape deck that I shouldn't be so worried about tape noise. I quit Dolby and never looked back (and never worried about pressing the Dolby button again).

    Just spit balling here, but my prejudices sometimes come to the surface when I hear a Dicks or Daves or Road Trips that sounds a bit muffled and I wonder if the particular Reel or Cassette or Betamax or whatever might have had a Dolby snafu baked in. To be clear, I have no proof this has ever occurred, I just wonder sometimes.

    I should emphasize Jeffrey Norman / David Glasser, etc. have gotten better at their jobs. So if there is any compression or noise reduction used anywhere along the way, they better at making this music sound as good as it possibly can, regardless of the sordid history of the source tapes. Thank you GD, Mockingbird Studios, the good folks and Plangent Processing and all the others that get this music to my front porch. Oh, and thank you tapers too!

  • Oroborous
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    Ooops, forgot

    I can’t say for sure off hand about everyone who recorded Dead and NR, but Betty was known for not using it, and if things are done right, no need.
    Nothing comes for free, so every time you do something, it will effect other things, sometimes negatively…a cost benefit trade off…perhaps just like BITD with high gen cassettes? To Dolby or not to Dolby, that is the question lol
    I always have tried not to do any permanent adjustments/fixes, preferring to try and fix some other way, eq etc, but nothing permanent that you can’t fix yer fix!

    Imho NR etc becomes more of a band aid for when things weren’t able to be right, or to help mask issues beyond repair, i.e., the ravages of time.
    Don’t think I’ve ever used any on a master recording?

    Onto rest of GDM soundtrack this afternoon…

  • 1stshow70878
    Joined:
    Thx Oro

    So 15 ips or 30 ips would have been impractical for shows I imagine. Expense, changing reels too often, and as these were for listening by the band not studio use, etc. But what about them using noise reduction? I'm guessing no Dolby.
    As an aside, I seldom have my Dolby on when listening to cassettes even though most were recorded with it. Even factory tapes with Dolby seem less muffled without it and I'm not listening at thunderous levels (most of the time) where hiss is an issue.
    Skylabs, a top notch mid-western audio repairer, no longer works on certain categories of equipment: Consoles, quad receivers, linear tracking turntables, automatic turntables, and reel to reels. Just not worth it from a cost perspective for what those machines sell for vs. repair costs. There are still plenty of specialists who will and R-to-Rs are available restored at very reasonable prices but good luck finding pre-recorded tapes (old or new). Nobody makes them anymore. I was never tempted but my cassette guy sells tons of R-to-Rs for like $200-$300 fully restored, but they are more run of the mill Sony and not high end. And they sell fast!
    Thanks again and cheers bro

  • Oroborous
    Joined:
    First half of GDM soundtrack

    Ist show. The more surface area (wider the tape), and/or the faster the recording speed, the higher the resolution. And yes R2R can most certainly sound best. (Like anything though, if done well)
    The problem is a good one is very expensive, they’re as hard to keep maintained etc as a TT, and good linage quality tapes are rare and expensive, oh, and more a pain to “flip” than even a record…but they can sound amazing!

    Remember, many CDs AND most vinyl are sourced from (hopefully) master R2R tapes! A purist with the gear and ears might argue that direct to (vinyl) disc recording is the ultimate…but good luck lol
    One of the main reasons digital still gets such a bad rap is twofold
    1- the conversion used originally, and lack of attention to disparity’s between different DACs in the chain. Conversion has come a loonnggg way baby! AND…
    2- a significant number of the CDs first produced to meet the huge demand were not sourced from the master tapes, and lineage and source quality were often a joke! Caveat emptor: not all CDs are created alike!…or Blu-ray’s, or DVDs, or Vinyl etc Like drugs boys and girls, know your sources!

  • 1stshow70878
    Joined:
    4-11-78

    5th show in the box.
    OK, now were getting there.
    Great 1st set.
    2nd set list looks good too.
    Moving right along...
    Cheers

    Random ?s for the tapers and the knowledgeable. Were these original tapes running at 7.5 ips on reel to reels and were they done with any Dolby or whatever? And do you audience tapers use any noise reduction? Been talking to an analog guy who says with reel to reel running fast you get superior saturation and the best analog sound of all, which to his ear beats CDs and even vinyl, and Dolby is unnecessary for good reel to reel recordings.

  • uncle_tripel
    Joined:
    "Don't...

    climb on the fence, you idiot"

    august 6th 1974

    now that's much better, the sound is less polished or over-dubbed...or whatever...

    support your local library,
    my better half's employer also

    Peace for All!
    uncle_tripel

    PS - Hey Bobby, party like it's 1984, Happy B-day!

  • Colin Gould
    Joined:
    Right now

    This is a little niche for this forum since I’m streaming it on BBC iplayer so it’s probably only accessible in the UK,
    John Martyn - Live at Reading University 1978
    This is an episode of ‘Rock Goes to College’. We saw him several times 78 -79 and his solo concerts were always excellent. It’s available for the next 27 days and is highly recommended. For those who can’t access it I recommend his album ‘One World’ which was his current album when this concert was recorded.
    Edit: To be honest I’d recommend any of his albums really

  • Oroborous
    Joined:
    Slumming it ; )

    With Dave’s 17, since the rude abrupt halt to my research via the archive being down : (
    Ah well, I’ll just have to suffer lol

    Hope their highly trained crack equipment crew gets it just exactly perfect sooner than later 🤞Was gonna do the big five O anniversary treatment of Rocktober 74, complete in order as I don’t think I’ve done so? Sigh…bastards!

    Kudos to Uncle T supporting the local Library! (TOO is a librarian ; )
    If you don’t use em, ya lose em!
    And remember, they killed Marion ; )

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17 years 6 months
New year, new update. Tell us of your musical adventures in real time!

JohnSiddique - that's an incredible album. There is a superb box set that came out a few years ago called "In Search of Hades" which features all Tangerine Dreams albums for Virgin between 1973 and 1979, plus outtakes and live concerts. Included are 2 cds of outtakes from "Phaedra" which are so good they could easily have been released as official follow ups to the album in question. Highly recommended!

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11 years 4 months

In reply to by daverock

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Fox Theatre
St. Louis

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4 years 4 months

In reply to by TN John

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You are in the zone!

:)))

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11 years 4 months

In reply to by proudfoot

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The Palladium

Proudfoot
I'm in the short side of life, and still have a lot of listening left.
Lol

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...Rock Scully's book "Twenty Years on the Bus with Garcia and The Grateful Dead - LIVING WITH THE DEAD"
crazy, excessive, obsessive, mournful, heartbreaking...if you haven't read it, make the time to read and gain an insider's view of an artist's life on the road

Today, it's Baltimore 1972 Sept 17th [diP #23]
this is the GOOD stuff

Peace for All!
uncle_tripel

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Excellent show from the Giants box. I believe it was VGUY, not that long ago, was commenting on this show (about Phil I think).

I think Phil was a bit of an MVP in the Welnick era. Many Phil-lead jams from this era are fantastic! Check out Playin>Terrapin from RFK 6/26/93 or the Terrapin from Deer Creek 93, to name but a couple.

This 6/16/91 show stands in the shadow of 6/17/91, but its a damn fine show, none the less!!

Rock on, gang

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17 years 5 months

In reply to by jonathan918@GD

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Ahead of schedule, so why not some early 80!

Tis Jonathan, surely is.

Ole Rock. Interesting read, but probably not so accurate lol
At least that’s what other insiders suggest…

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Bob James 3 w/ Grover Washington Jr.
A cocktail jazz album I likely bought in early college era ('76?) and got a lot of play at parties when we were trying to impress the girls with our sophisticated tastes, lol. The CTI jazz label always had all star casts of players on albums like Hubert Laws, Eric Gale, Jon Faddis, and so many others. Maynard Ferguson thought Bob was a great producer too.
Cheers

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17 years 5 months

In reply to by TN John

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Bit of a creeper?

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9 years 1 month

In reply to by Oroborous

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In order, spread out over the last 3 nights.
Wrapping up the 19th now.

Time for the World Music Theater Box 7-21,22,23-90 complete audio and video.

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In reply to by icecrmcnkd

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Fox Theatre
St. Louis

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...there's 1973 for today after yesterday's wonderful baltimore show;
1973 march 22 set 2 utica ny
thank you very much

Peace for All!
uncle_tripel

oro, of course any & all of the family's/relative's written remembrances are being taken with a grain of salt

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Just finished a rip roaring 5/1/80 for those who love 80.
Yeah it’s and Aud, but Doctor Bob does a good job and the audience factor isn’t bad!
Ragging into 5/2/80, whoa…opener sounds like the boys are ready to rock!
Another Doc B aud, which so far has more audience, but at least no, ya know ; )

Yeah Uncle, they all have their own angle lol. Which I guess is normal?
Bet Bobs would be interesting if he could ever finish it lol

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9 15 90
MSG

Edit
This show has a very special feel to it. I am impressed.

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11 years 4 months

In reply to by proudfoot

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Ohio Theatre [2nd Set]

That excellent Dicks, Vol. 2.

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4 years 4 months

In reply to by TN John

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Hearing that release years ago at a local park is a treasured experience

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9 years 1 month

In reply to by proudfoot

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From 30 Trips.

The DSBD’s from the 90’s usually sound real good.
We could use a few more released.
Maybe in 2025 we’ll get 30 Trips Part 2.

Update:
Jerry’s belting it out at the end of So Many Roads.
And he sings ‘to heal’ rather than ‘to ease’ or ‘to tease’.
SMR is a grate late-era song.

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4 years 4 months

In reply to by icecrmcnkd

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Husker Du zen arcade
Husker Du new day rising

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4 years 4 months

In reply to by proudfoot

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Think about the quick turnaround

Brent dies on July 26

GD play next show only 43 days later

That's extremely remarkable

I have never heard 9/7 nor 9/8

None of Philly

Gotta check out 9 7 and 8 for historical purposes at least

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Fall 1990 is an absolute testament to the bands talent. Also a reality check as far as being prepared for crisis. I can't imagine the excitement/terror running through Vince Welnick veins when the house lights went down on 9/7/90

I believe the boys, including Vince and soon Bruce, played their asses off for the fans and themselves! Resulting in a damn fine tour.

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In reply to by jonathan918@GD

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Were not bad at all.
The building was electric…what would happen? Would they suck, lots of apprehension etc. But after they started playing the whole building seemed to breath this ubiquitous sigh of relief, and yes, this will be different, but it’s gonna be alright!
Definitely check them out! Yeah Jonathan, I think they tried to do well on the tour because of the situation. I’ve not heard all of fall 90, but what I’ve heard I’ve enjoyed! Reminds me to hit that RT that I’ve only recently received. Good Sheet Mon!

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In reply to by Oroborous

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Beacon Theatre

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In reply to by TN John

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Excellent show

I was a little "ugh-y" at the last two tracks of set 2 (can you guess which two I am refering to?) but I accepted and moved on quickly

Onward to 9/16/90

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In reply to by proudfoot

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Husker Du new day rising "celebrated summer"

One of my favorite songs of all time

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In reply to by proudfoot

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Good, but maybe a step off the previous few?

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4 years 1 month
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Zappa: You Can't Do That Onstage Anymore, Vol 2

I run hot on cold when it comes to Frank, whose "humor" I often find obnoxious. But man, the band on this gig? Unbelievable.

And some of jokes are actually funny!

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In reply to by Oroborous

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A personal favorite

The China Rider...the first time I visited Lysergia I FELT it coming on during that combo

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In reply to by Oroborous

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Decided to join in.

European tour was already booked. At World Music Theater they were passing out flyers for Europe travel packages. Then Brent departed.
Had to fill the position quick, but Bruce refused to become the permanent replacement.
The Tubes were done, and Vince tried out for the job……

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In reply to by icecrmcnkd

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Madison Square Garden

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...sad to say that I was done with the crowds and extraneous BS after Oxford 7/3/88.
After learning of Brent's passing while vacationing in Acadia & Bar Harbor, Maine, the decision was made to see the Fat Man as much as possible moving forward before it was too late.
My 1st show back to see the "new" GD was 9/16 @ MSG and so thankful.
Crowd reactions were great, and Hornsby's grand facing Garcia allowed them to easily exchange smiles...and while things are always in perpetual motion...at the time we were all SO happy to be able to experience
the GOGD, no matter what iteration the band happened to be in.

Peace for All!
uncle_tripel

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...to find out...1973 October 30 Kiel Aud is a great way to move into the weekend, so every one enjoy another summer weekend and...that you are the eyes of the world!

Peace for you today and everyday!
uncle_tripel

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4 years 4 months

In reply to by Oroborous

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GD at Woodstock

I'd listen to that, but after I heard it last time I decided...never again.

I want to listen to the MSG box...I have so many others to listen to first. MSG 90, Greeks 89, April 78...

Please Lord, grant me time to listen to all of this wonderful stuff

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10 years 3 months

In reply to by proudfoot

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The "Dark Star" is okay - I might play that later, but the rest of the set is a bit of a dog. A much better bet would be Jimi Hendrix from later the same day. This is one of my favourite Jimi Hendrix shows - the closing "Star Spangled Banner -Purple Haze - Woodstock Improvisation - Villanova Junction" has to be heard...and seen...to be believed.

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4 years 4 months

In reply to by daverock

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Wow.

Just...

Wow.

He's Gone to end of encore is truly special.

:)))

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4 years 4 months

In reply to by proudfoot

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The Cars

First album

Beautiful stuff

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9 years 1 month

In reply to by daverock

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Playing now.

Maybe I’ll watch the movie tomorrow night.
Will at least watch Hendrix.

One of many who died waaay too young

Buddy Holly...22!

Meanwhile, some people just keep on ticking.

Newsflash: life ain't always fair

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In reply to by proudfoot

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Frost Amphitheatre

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In reply to by proudfoot

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It's an amazing privilege to grow old. If you can access medical treatment, as most of us on here seem to be able to, then we can now live much longer than in earlier years or in more disadvantaged countries. With further medical treatment to help us in old age, we have a lot to be grateful for.