True dat
Absolutely no noise reduction ON THE RECORDING, but that doesn’t mean some kind of processing on the final release, and, it seemed like 4/12 sounded much different, especially in the frequency spectrum we’ve been discussing.
There are other ways in mastering to treat noise beyond basic noise reduction, like, not your 80s tape deck Dolby…
I’ve been looking at pics and some don’t seem to have overhead drum mics where others certainly do. But haven’t dug deep so don’t know dates that correspond to pics etc. Just wonder if that was something Betty was messing with as she’s known for her mic placement perhaps above all else…
Also noticed JG moved into the center, and Bob to the left, (as per their stage orientation at the time) of the soundstage on maybe the 10th? Before that they were switched, and the 12 all kinds of things going on lol,
Always fun to try and dissect things!
4/12/78
Hmmmm?
Another quirky good but inconsistent show?
Definitely a creeper. Starts a bit off (technically and otherwise) but by mid set they start settling in and syncing up. Second set, like much of this tour may not be flawless, but their is some fine playing and highlights!. And I’ll have to find that video cause wondering WTH was up with JG at the end etc? Wow?
These shows are hard to pin down, interesting run.
14 mañana…
Drum mic's
Among others they would have a mic over each drummer either hanging or on stands four feet above each drum kit since sound rises from the drums, cymbals.
4/15 Dap sounds better?
Rolling into the 15th hot! After second set from the 14th.
B.E. is all over the place. Funny at times! LIG cooks!!
4/14/78
See how this one stands up..
Curious about the sound stage and recording consistency?
EDIT: this one mos def moved up a notch from the one previous time I heard it.
Really sweet show, perhaps most well played consistent of all so far?
Perhaps same with the mix/audio…definitely cymbals now, and everyone is in their proper soundstage position etc, good sheet Mon!
Overall, Maybe not some of the previous fireworks but very few lows. Only Ooops, and a small one, I can think of was in the otherwise delightful Dancing! It’s like their coalescing or morphing into a cohesive beast, but one with patience and finesse, and having a fine time doing so!
Eager to see how the 15 resonates after this one?
Mañana…
Overhead mics: yeah, I’m well aware what they are/for, i was trying to imply that “if” she hadn’t used them at some of the shows, then that might explain less prevalent cymbals…or maybe they were used but turned down…
since the pictures aren’t dated it’s hard to determine. In fact the pic on the last page shows Bob playing an Ibanez Musician Series guitar, which from the pictures I’ve seen (if dated correctly) he used from 5/5/78 until Egypt. So is that picture not from this tour, or did he use it at some point on the tour?
I’ve seen pics of Jerry trying one out also, but no idea when?
Drums and microphones
Check the 4-12-78 video, maybe there’s a good shot of the drum setup.
Duke video
Finally checked it last night, wow.
Puts a whole new spin on things!
These shows just got even better…
Definitely overheads, but that doesn’t surprise as it’s the first 2 or three shows that sound different.
Right now
Despite the seemingly endless stream of box sets coming into the house I am actually listening to ‘Absolute Elsewhere’ by Blood Incantation. They’re described as death metal in the review in the latest issue of The Wire magazine, but I won’t hold that against them. The reviewer calls it a goddamn masterpiece. I’ll need to listen a few times to see if I agree but it is certainly interesting and I like to hear new things.
Don't think it's mic's
Some of these shows have static I think digital NR was used to attenuate the static and it took the highs also.
Just got back from a show by Hans Zimmer and a big production
Great show
He does music for movies
My nephew came to town and took me to the event
Impressive
Jacob Jolliff mandolin
Last night at a small venue in Lyndon Vermont with George Jackson on violin, Ross Martin guitar and Myles Sloniker bass. Outstanding bluegrass and beyond. Peak foliage, peak music.
Ah, ha, ha, ha...
...stayin' alive, stayin' alive
April 24 1978
horton field house
lol horton hears keith doin' a my uncle is stayin' alive
while phil continues on with the big river stayin' alive beat
Peace for All!
uncle_tripel
4-10-78
Fox Theater, fourth show in the box. Good rowdy start with Promised Land.
Not really saving it but having trouble keeping up a pace. Maybe be finished with the first run through by the time 52 gets here. Purposely not listening to my tapes of that show to keep it fresh. Think I heard it last year as I vaguely remember V-guy recommending it. (Unseasonably hot in Vegas right now - 105 degrees? Wowzer!)
Cheers
go west young man...
...park west ski resort, park city utah
september 4 1983
drowned in your laughter
and DEAD to the core
well, yes, this board was recorded out in the open air is just :)
and since #52 is also outdoors at HIGH altitude ;)
just waiting patiently to find out
peace for all
uncle_tripel
And finally…
Stayin alive indeed!
4/24/78 to finish off this long strange trip that started back on 1/6/78 lol
ABB 1-17-71
Syria Mosque.
CD spinning now, first listen and it’s some good stuff.
Park West
What an interesting show. Pairs nicely with the Santa Fe from the same year that rumor has it will grace our front doorsteps in a month give or take.
The small venue canaries began to die in '83 and Park City stands out as a place the band might not be invited back to play. Yet crowd sizes began to grow in the early 80's (keep crowd size comments to a minimum).
But boy, if you got into one of these smaller venue grande locale venues and the boys were on (which they often were), boy howdy was it a heel kickin' paper lickin' good time.
I did not attend Park City but man oh man oh man oh my, I wish I had.
Park City
Close friend had an awesome time at that '83 show - he has a fond recollection of an endless stream of party favors moving along the line, help yourself and pass it along, as they waited to get in.
The '87 show is a personal favorite from that year.
Saw Bob and Wolf Brothers there last year. Awesome show on a stone cold gorgeous late summer evening/night. Just a stage set in front of the slope. My brother and I talked to some old timers we met there about whether the stage for Bob and Wolf Brothers was in same place as the earlier Dead shows. Memories were hazy but it seemed that it had moved, probably because there had been a lot of development over the years.
rupp...
arena...in lexington ky
april 21 1978
set 2
10/6/84 saturday night
went with 3 friends for a long weekend to VA
2 friends swore-off GOGD concerts after that night
so upset, so mad about the performance
particularly the lead guitarist
had to listen to them for the entire 6 hour ride home (lol as I write this)
they wrote them off,
and they NEVER returned
those poor lost souls
Peace for All!
uncle_tripel
Hack job
Wonder if the arch breach is why I couldn’t get anything to play yesterday afternoon? Was on relisten not arch, but I thought shows were sourced from arch? I don’t have an account on arch so hopefully no worries there…
Why would anyone want to mess with the archive? Idiots!
Nothing… : (
That’s the way it’s been in town, ever since they tore the juke box down…
What kinda ahole would purposely FU something as benevolent as the archive!
Displaying the 30 Trips Scroll
Hi all. I know this isn't the correct forum topic for this - but when I searched, I found that no one had posted in the "30 Trips Box Set and Digital" thread since 2017. Not sure if it's good form here at dead dot net to necro a thread, so...
I'm wondering if anyone has framed or found a more economical way to display the scroll from the 30 Trips box set? Asking bc I just picked up a second such scroll for the specific purpose of doing this. I want to show it to the data science and graphic visualization students at the high school where I work. But I didn't realize how LONG this thing is! Looks like I'd have to order a custom frame.
I know I could just reproduce it on the large-format color printer that we have... but I sorta want to show off the genuine article, not just for the edification of the students, but also for my own satisfaction! However, at first blush it's not going to be much cheaper to place it between two custom-cut pieces of acrylic (my first "low cost" idea) as it would be to bite the bullet and order a custom frame. So did anyone else go down this road/have any suggestions? Thank you all in advance, and sorry to hijack the thread.
More on target: I am listening to "Pig's Boogie" from the 12/31/75 JGB show as I type this.
I Listened and I Heard Music in a Word
Holy guacamole. Why did I not get this when it first came out? Kind of late to the party here, but sheesh, the Who's Next/Life House box is pretty darned incredibly awesome.
Maybe I hesitated because, like everybody else who was alive in 1971, I've heard Who's Next about 789 billion times and figured maybe I didn't need yet another copy. Truth be told, the current remix doesn't add much.
BUT the demos and outtakes are outstanding (for once). Early versions of Teenage Wasteland and some others from Who's Next are like entirely different songs. But still good! And in good sound.
And then Life House. Some of the songs intended for the ill fated "opera" are better than songs that eventually made it to Who's Next. Which is saying something, because that album is pretty solid start to finish. Plus you get some singles from that period (The Seeker, Join Together) that I loved at the time. Plus two complete gigs. From a period where the Who were just ripping it up on state night after night. Plus not one but two coffee table books.
This is what's commonly called some really good shit.
rupp...
...unfortunately found out that my disc is corrupt after Stella,
so no truckin' > pitb or encores; whatcha gonna do?
anyways...
today, I'm gonna extend the friends of the devils theme to
september 16 1978 set 2
ollin arrageed (hamza el din)
everyone enjoy your weekend!
make LOVE, not WAR!!!
uncle_tripel
PS - new upcoming box set...maybe...?....in 2026...
May 1978...that would be something
yeah, so ...
...this weekend I visited our local library, been awhile...
took home the 5 CD GOGD Movie Soundtrack box...
today's listening party:
oct 20 1974 set 2
maybe, I'll need to listen to this box abit more, or maybe not...?
finding the mix is almost like, well, you know, too studioish...
... DL announcement later this week, hey now, how about it?
make LOVE, not WAR!!!
uncle_tripel
Slumming it ; )
With Dave’s 17, since the rude abrupt halt to my research via the archive being down : (
Ah well, I’ll just have to suffer lol
Hope their highly trained crack equipment crew gets it just exactly perfect sooner than later 🤞Was gonna do the big five O anniversary treatment of Rocktober 74, complete in order as I don’t think I’ve done so? Sigh…bastards!
Kudos to Uncle T supporting the local Library! (TOO is a librarian ; )
If you don’t use em, ya lose em!
And remember, they killed Marion ; )
Right now
This is a little niche for this forum since I’m streaming it on BBC iplayer so it’s probably only accessible in the UK,
John Martyn - Live at Reading University 1978
This is an episode of ‘Rock Goes to College’. We saw him several times 78 -79 and his solo concerts were always excellent. It’s available for the next 27 days and is highly recommended. For those who can’t access it I recommend his album ‘One World’ which was his current album when this concert was recorded.
Edit: To be honest I’d recommend any of his albums really
"Don't...
climb on the fence, you idiot"
august 6th 1974
now that's much better, the sound is less polished or over-dubbed...or whatever...
support your local library,
my better half's employer also
Peace for All!
uncle_tripel
PS - Hey Bobby, party like it's 1984, Happy B-day!
4-11-78
5th show in the box.
OK, now were getting there.
Great 1st set.
2nd set list looks good too.
Moving right along...
Cheers
Random ?s for the tapers and the knowledgeable. Were these original tapes running at 7.5 ips on reel to reels and were they done with any Dolby or whatever? And do you audience tapers use any noise reduction? Been talking to an analog guy who says with reel to reel running fast you get superior saturation and the best analog sound of all, which to his ear beats CDs and even vinyl, and Dolby is unnecessary for good reel to reel recordings.
First half of GDM soundtrack
Ist show. The more surface area (wider the tape), and/or the faster the recording speed, the higher the resolution. And yes R2R can most certainly sound best. (Like anything though, if done well)
The problem is a good one is very expensive, they’re as hard to keep maintained etc as a TT, and good linage quality tapes are rare and expensive, oh, and more a pain to “flip” than even a record…but they can sound amazing!
Remember, many CDs AND most vinyl are sourced from (hopefully) master R2R tapes! A purist with the gear and ears might argue that direct to (vinyl) disc recording is the ultimate…but good luck lol
One of the main reasons digital still gets such a bad rap is twofold
1- the conversion used originally, and lack of attention to disparity’s between different DACs in the chain. Conversion has come a loonnggg way baby! AND…
2- a significant number of the CDs first produced to meet the huge demand were not sourced from the master tapes, and lineage and source quality were often a joke! Caveat emptor: not all CDs are created alike!…or Blu-ray’s, or DVDs, or Vinyl etc Like drugs boys and girls, know your sources!
Thx Oro
So 15 ips or 30 ips would have been impractical for shows I imagine. Expense, changing reels too often, and as these were for listening by the band not studio use, etc. But what about them using noise reduction? I'm guessing no Dolby.
As an aside, I seldom have my Dolby on when listening to cassettes even though most were recorded with it. Even factory tapes with Dolby seem less muffled without it and I'm not listening at thunderous levels (most of the time) where hiss is an issue.
Skylabs, a top notch mid-western audio repairer, no longer works on certain categories of equipment: Consoles, quad receivers, linear tracking turntables, automatic turntables, and reel to reels. Just not worth it from a cost perspective for what those machines sell for vs. repair costs. There are still plenty of specialists who will and R-to-Rs are available restored at very reasonable prices but good luck finding pre-recorded tapes (old or new). Nobody makes them anymore. I was never tempted but my cassette guy sells tons of R-to-Rs for like $200-$300 fully restored, but they are more run of the mill Sony and not high end. And they sell fast!
Thanks again and cheers bro
Ooops, forgot
I can’t say for sure off hand about everyone who recorded Dead and NR, but Betty was known for not using it, and if things are done right, no need.
Nothing comes for free, so every time you do something, it will effect other things, sometimes negatively…a cost benefit trade off…perhaps just like BITD with high gen cassettes? To Dolby or not to Dolby, that is the question lol
I always have tried not to do any permanent adjustments/fixes, preferring to try and fix some other way, eq etc, but nothing permanent that you can’t fix yer fix!
Imho NR etc becomes more of a band aid for when things weren’t able to be right, or to help mask issues beyond repair, i.e., the ravages of time.
Don’t think I’ve ever used any on a master recording?
Onto rest of GDM soundtrack this afternoon…
Noise Reduction and...
I used Dolby for a brief blink of an eye when I first started copying tapes. Being young and naive, I thought who wants tape noise to come through on the recording, duh.. no brainer, I flipped the Dolby switch on my Nak and hit record. I just want to hear the music, no hiss.
Very quickly reality set in. Was it Dolby A or Dolby B? Was the source tape recording using Dolby, if so, if you hit Dolby wouldn't it further compress the recording and further alter the sound, you can't play back using Dolby Squared, right? And what do you do in the car, in the boom box (yes.. we were just a few years out of 8 tracks when I started getting tapes). And who really flips or unflips the Dolby switch anyway based on how you think the recording was made. After all, were all these tapes properly notated every step of the way.
So I quickly gave up on noise reduction, I had a good enough tape deck that I shouldn't be so worried about tape noise. I quit Dolby and never looked back (and never worried about pressing the Dolby button again).
Just spit balling here, but my prejudices sometimes come to the surface when I hear a Dicks or Daves or Road Trips that sounds a bit muffled and I wonder if the particular Reel or Cassette or Betamax or whatever might have had a Dolby snafu baked in. To be clear, I have no proof this has ever occurred, I just wonder sometimes.
I should emphasize Jeffrey Norman / David Glasser, etc. have gotten better at their jobs. So if there is any compression or noise reduction used anywhere along the way, they better at making this music sound as good as it possibly can, regardless of the sordid history of the source tapes. Thank you GD, Mockingbird Studios, the good folks and Plangent Processing and all the others that get this music to my front porch. Oh, and thank you tapers too!
always...
...avoided the NR on recording
and found very early the highs just got too muted for my ear,
returning to some more 1978 this week:
june 4th 1978
at Campus Stadium, UCSB in Santa Barbara, Ca
some more friends of the devils? lol...
...= the "on stage" harley davidson acceleration into--->NFA
make LOVE, not war!
PEACE!
uncle_tripel
PS: new avatar = mickey & jerry on 7/4/86 @ Rich Stadium