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    marye
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    Nuclear power! Carcinogenic cell phones! The Stanley Cup! and the usual parade of kids dancing and shaking their bones, politicians throwing stones, etc. Discuss.

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  • TigerLilly
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    I vote that the post about burning Palestinian children gets yanked out of here. Anybody agree, or is that just me hating that one?
  • Anonymous (not verified)
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    North Korean Major Domo dies of heart attack
    The North Korean people are long-suffering, living on food hand-outs from China. This paternal line regime change is not expected to bring change to the regional politics of the area. It would appear that their missile and nuclear programs are in disarray and a large majority of the population suffers from malnutrition. The only caveat here is: How desperate will the new leader get? He could start a war. The last incident of sinking a S. Korean destroyer brought diplomatic temps. to a boil. A larger provocation would involve supreme patience from S. Korea. It is highly likely that the US would become involved in some capacity and so would the Chinese. Very dangerous flashpoint. So, hopefully, N.Korea's new leader (with only several years in a Western prep school) has a level head and moves the two Koreas toward unification in the same way collapsing support from the USSR brought the Germanys together. Nice thought, but not good odds.
  • Anonymous (not verified)
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    WTF?
    Nothing like starting your Monday off with in-depth analysis of Chinese basketball players by a Chinese fan who has probably never heard the Grateful Dead. And that topped off by a spammer, the cherry on that strange-flavored cake!
  • Anonymous (not verified)
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    Patriot Nation rolls over Broncos, clinch division
    Tom Brady and the Patriots rolled over Tebow and the Broncos. No fourth quartermiracle for God's quarterback. Surprisingly, the Pats. secondary played wirth some cohesion. Brady had an average day and hit almost every receiver except Ochocinco multiple times and they scored more than 40 points. It's hard not to get excited about the Pats. but the playoffs are looming.
  • Anonymous (not verified)
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    ...and lower.
    Iran and Pakistan do not pose a threat.if they do, they have been goaded into this reasoning by manipulation and coercion. this isn't to say they are pure and innocent; all sweetness and light, but constant taunting and secretive yet blatant twisting of the screws; willful moulding and oleaginous and self-serving influence on a data, media and psychological level will provoke them into doing the very things the West "abhors" (and i use that word most wrongly, children), giving the bullies a self imposed justification for invasion, occupancy, torture, murder and control. it's sickeningly smug and easy when you think about it; lies, discrimination, falsification and corruption, can guide a hand to commit atrocities in an agenda never previously considered. by this same token, when will other countries decide to liberate the U.S.? or Europe? or the UK? when is our turn, that a group of people decide that we need a democracy (lets not kid ourselves that we live in one; it's barely concealed. better than most, but injustice is entertained on a major scale here. look at the recent signing and approval by the White House, President, House Of Representatives and others regarding the law concerning holding "terror" suspects (and i use that word quite wrongly, children) for indefinite periods without any kind of investigation or charge, reason or rhyme. how charming. a drone recently crashed in Tehran. the U.S. asked for it's immediate return. i think that tells you all one needs to know about the mind set we're dealing with. i promised myself i wouldn't respond to negativity and pessimism; but things are too hard to take. i wash my hands of this stain on humankind. we must aim higher.
  • Anonymous (not verified)
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    Strategic objectives in war
    The oligarchs control the politicians and they declare the wars. Their objectives are based on raw materials and labor and markets. They depend on "think-tanks" for guidance. Morality has absolutely nothing to do with it. If it did, we would have had a multi-national force in Rwanda in the 90s. National pride cannot be discounted also if the Falklands war is any indication. That is why we are surely heading for a war with Pakistan and Iran. Pakistan has about 5-20 nukes and Iran is closer to 2 than 3 years from developing a operational theatre nuclear-tipped missile. I think the only dividing reason between Israel and the US executing the Iran war-strike is who has the better ordnance. Given the deeply reinforced concrete tunnels Iran has constructed I think we can look forward to mini-nukes to bust the bunkers. The oligarchs reason for a hamstrung Iran is to keep the oil moving. Pakistan is out-to-lunch and so unstable that it is imperative that their nukes be taken away from them lest terrorists get their hands on one. Afghanistan's war will be over in 2014, hopefully. Who has won? I would say the warlords in coalition with the Taliban. Nobody holds on to a desolate piece of rock. When the foreigners go it will be back to business as usual. The rich 1% are the only ones who want these wars, aside from religious extremists and they have become woefully anachronistic. Look at the progress of computers and look at the progress of human beings. Negative emotions are killing us and machines lack emotion. It would seem that if human beings are to survive our destiny must be put in the hands of computers with programs written by Tibetan Lamas. Rise of the Nanny-Bots!
  • Anonymous (not verified)
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    sinking lower
    yes, a wonderful thought provoking post.its such detachment and desensitization that allows us to eradicate human life without ever really feeling we're involved. but it's also important to learn the lessons from past conflicts and understand the suffering that some soldiers and their families may have to endure. there are many reasons why individuals join the armed forces, some of them never expecting or comprehending just what it would entail. the amount of U.S. life left dead is nowhere near the amount of innocent Iraqi civilians but this just highlights the fact that in war, if proof were ever needed, no one ever truly wins. we mustn't allow ourselves to fall into the trap; the ease with which independent bystanders can sit, imaginary pipes puffed and heads held aloft and castigate and make devastating judgments (of which i'm sadly all too prone) on others in the knowing luxury of our living rooms, comfortably removed. lives are destroyed, with the privileged few pushing the buttons, determining the horror and mental anguish that will surely follow; we must think clearly and treat this situation with sensitivity and respect. true, some involved will have no regrets whatsoever. but some lives will be ripped apart and will cost them and their families dearly, maybe forever. read the harrowing book "Human Shrapnel" by Bill Shields for an insight into the human cost of warfare, a soldier left mentally eviscerated, then shunned by his country upon return. pain and suffering is all one will achieve through war. no justice, just manipulation, greed and hurt. we must not tar everyone with the same brush. there are, hard to believe when we're passionate about such immoral behaviour, innocents on all sides. no one ever truly wins. (i wrote a much better piece earlier but the computer crashed halfway through, losing everything; FUCKING thing). sorry.
  • TigerLilly
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    Really well written post, Dean!BRAVO!
  • gratefaldean
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    During the "run up"
    To the Iraq invasion, a my-age Providence (RI) Journal columnist came out in favor of the war. I was quite dismayed and more than a little surprised, since until that time I had thought that we had pretty similar viewpoints. I shot off an email to him with a series of points to consider, to reconsider. It wasn't a letter-to-the-editor, but a more direct personal entreaty to try to change his mind. A couple of weeks later, he wrote a follow-up column in which excerpted comments from several of his readers, including one of mine. He honed in on the most impassioned of my points, which was this: "do you believe so strongly in the 'cause' that is fueling this war-fervor that you are willing to give up your life for it? The lives of your children? Are you willing to have the blood of innocent children on your hands? If the answer is 'no,' then you have no business promoting ANY war, and most especially this one." This all so very personal to me, and I know that my attitude is largely fueled by growing up with the constant looming threat of being drafted to fight in Vietnam. Put aside the geo-petro politics, the business-interest influence, the Bush-team vendetta -- killing is wrong and I need a very imminent threat to life and home to condone organizing the deployment of a massive kill team to prosecute a war in my name. It has become so much easier to kill from a distance (drones, the most recent innovation. Sleep in your own home and attack a target half a world away during your work hours...aside from pushing the button on the ICBMs, I can't imagine a more detached and immoral way to kill, when the only physical danger you may face is the risk of a paper cut), and without a military draft any war fought by the US carries no risk of personal involvement by the average US non-GI Joe. We've managed to carry on our 21st century wars without it ever really seeming as if the country was at war at all...except to the direct participants and their families. Well, if we are going to be at war, we all better be cognizant of the human consequences and of our personal complicity in the taking of lives -- lives on both sides of the conflict. The Iraq war was never worth it. It'll be decades before we can really look at the consequences to determine (guess at, as we have no clue as to the consequences of not fighting the war) whether we did more harm than good. Do the war dead get a vote?
  • Anonymous (not verified)
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    reduction
    appallingly, we could be discussing the very same thing in regards to Syrians soon. just when WILL the U.S. learn? your government is ultimately putting the entire world at risk. again. it's not enough to suffer natural disasters (or manmade "natural disasters"); catastrophic events like flooding, earthquakes and tsunamis; 20,000 Japanese suspected to be dead or missing. families destroyed. generations removed. murders, accidents, religious discontent that has killed and kills more and more human beings every day. unforeseen health issues that stop a baby's, child's and adult's life dead in its tracks. but don't stop there..... let's beat our chests, grease up the coffers and ruthlessly inflate our egos in an impotent display to hurt, torture and murder innocent lives. you could almost laugh if it weren't for crying. just another broken heart...
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Nuclear power! Carcinogenic cell phones! The Stanley Cup! and the usual parade of kids dancing and shaking their bones, politicians throwing stones, etc. Discuss.

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Although the popular vote will be very close the Democratic "Get-Out-The-Vote" operation will be blistering and Obama has a n 86% chance of winning the eletoral vote. The Romulans and Republicans in general lied and lied and lied and attacked women's reproductive rights, among every other decent thing under the sun. After a ton of hard work we should be all raising a glass of champagne to 4 more years of progressive policies. Many thanks to Bruce Springsteen for his efforts in support of the president!
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12 years 6 months
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Will make a huge difference all around the world from Dubai to Mumbai to Shanghai. Like it or not you're a citizen of the Empire with all the rights and responsibilities. Jerry didn't give it any energy. Phil & Bob helped Obama four years ago. The Grateful Dead/Rex/Furthur support(ed) progressive policies that come from people like Barak Obama. I hate to sound pedantic, but this is the most important election until a progressive third party breaks through.
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and in the spirit of reaching across party lines, may some healing vibes and quality organic salve be applied to romney's booty for the severe spanking he received from his home state of massachusetts............ouch! "when life looks like easy street, .................."
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Congratulations to the President: may he enjoy a successful second term. Thank you all, especially the women voters, for supporting Barack Obama and surviving the barrage of negative advertising aka Rove and the Koch brothers. Washington and Colorado passed initiatives legalizing the recreational use of marijuana: wonder how long it will take Kansas to step in that direction??
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A truly great, Lincolnesque victory speech to a crowd of of 10k campaign workers who had to spend at least 20 hours knocking on doors. We should all hope that Republicans come to their senses and work to ensure health care, cuts in the military and a way to stop the interest on the national debt from going nuclear. In the words of Bush after his re-election: "I have earned political capital and i intend to use it." Bring it Mr. Obama!
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14 years 8 months
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Democratic demographics: lost white men won blacks won hispanics won woman (single, married, single moms) won asians The Republicans are dead!
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17 years 3 months
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Let's just say I have friends and family of all political persuasions, and I don't choose either for their politics. That said, I'm finding the plight of my lifelong-Republican sister, who cannot believe the hijacking of her party by the loonies, pretty interesting.
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17 years 2 months
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reminds me of lama gonzo in some ways. Good wishes to either, or both?
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17 years 2 months
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That Gonzo done good this election cycle. Anna, if you're in touch, send him congrats.
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when second congressional district representative tammy baldwin was elected to the u.s. house of representatives, displacing a genuinely shocked tommy thompson (good riddance)! tammy will be the 77th woman in the house, the first woman from wisconsin in the house, and the very first non-incumbent, openly gay person to serve in congress. she is a true progressive and a leading advocate for universal healthcare, energy independence, civil rights and women's reproductive rights. i will probably never see the day when women rule the house and the senate ( or the country) with their hearts and their minds, but it sure did my heart good on tuesday night to see that this politically bipolar state thought with their hearts and minds and made history by electing a TRUE representative of the people. way to go wisconsin and congratulations to tammy baldwin! and . . . . . . .since this is called "trouble ahead, trouble behind" i'll say -- with reservation: the house remains red the senate is blue once again obama is screwed! the obstructionistic behavior from boehner and norquist and company has already started in full force and it looks likely that pres. obama is going to have one hell of a fight on his hands for the next 4 years (again) with these assholes. i sincerely hope i'm wrong.
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The only thing is now the legislature and governorship in WI is single-party controlled...
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hence the "politically bipolar". sure don't know how the hell tea party muppet scott walker got voted in as gov. along with a tea party majority state congress and then folks here turn around and vote for tammy over tommy, but it happened. glad, too. she's a great change from this state's "norm" ploliticos and a good seed to have been planted. you know what else, wtj? one of my favorite pastries is an eclaire...... :))))))))))) hehehe
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73 Saturday > 23 Monday, in KC. Thanks to those of us who pushed for, participated in and contributed to the recent reelection of our US president. Like Marye mentioned, I too have an older sister hell-bent on voting Republican, regardless of who they are and what they stand for. I hope Congress will avert the fiscal cliff dilemma now facing us. Don't laugh too hard when the Chiefs get throttled in Pittsburgh tonight on national tv....
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- from an ex-doorman who used to load his limos every other weekend for the hamptons and would receive a check for $50 at the holidays from the wealthiest resident of 740 park avenue, n.y. -- exclusive home of more billionaires than any other address in the u.s. this youn man was fired as a doorman from 740 park avenue when he inadvertantly opened the limo doors in "incorrect sequence", thus causing the poor billionaire's ego some undue and unwarranted distress .........
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The Republicans may be down but they are not out. When Obama and the liberals have spent the US into bankruptcy in 4 years, the Republicans will rise again and save the country.
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Stalin had a word for you Obama lackies - useful idiots. Voting for your own demise. Obamacare puts your health into the hands of big, bloated out of touch government. 2700 pages of rules, taxes and regulation. Try reading a page sometime. Not one person who voted for it read it. 2700 pages written by lobbyists and special intrest groups. It has already increased health care costs. If it was so good, why was the subject avoided on this year's campaign trail? Why wasn't it implimented immidiatly? Why don't the eletists who voted for it subject themselves to it? San Fran Nan (Pelosi) idiotically stated " We have to pass the bill to find out what is in it" - How stuipid! (For good reading some day look into how her Starkist Tuna operation in American Samoa benefitted from the stimulus package). Socialism has never worked and will never work. Piven, Ayers, Alinsky - smart people - They know how to turn their followers into useful idiots. Don't fall into the trap. I remember the sadness I felt when it was announced that Woodstock was a "free" concert. Many people worked countless hours to deliver a great product. The glee from people who stormed onto the concert site was disappointing. The generation who wanted something for nothing is now stealing from future generations to bolster their own power. We are trillions in debt. A trillion seconds ago it was 29,000 B.C. I despise government and want less of it. Look for candidates who promote freedom, property rights and individual liberty. Oooo freedom, Oooooo Liberty.
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It is okay to disagree here. It is not okay to call people names. Cut it out. ME, forum moderator
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16 years 8 months
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are flying their flags at half mast
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the cupcakes with the squiggles on top any more? Back in the '50s, those things were hot stuff. Of course, back in the '50s they were probably made with real food ingredients, too.
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loved one of their products so much, they immortalized it in a song....... :) ...... (that's my belief and i'm stickin' with it) @mike: "a world without twinkies, ho hos,and ding dongs" who among us would be left? :D.....lol
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I loved those little cupcakes. I would peel off the frosting skin and eat that first before making my way to the cake. Life used to be so simple.
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14 years 8 months
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The arctic ice cap melted down to a record 24% ice-cap (in other words 76% ice free). 97% of the Greenland ice sheet was melting this year. Read the article from the NY Times @ nytimes.com/2012/09/20/science/earth/arctic-sea-ice-stops-melting-but-new-record-low-is-set.html?_r=0. 350.org, an environmental group crunching the numbers, with the help of Price, Warterhouse, Coopers, says that 2% is the amount of global rise in temperature that can be tolerated (a figure accepted by scientists worldwide). We are at 1%. The amount of carbon that can be spewed in the air before we reach that 2%, total, is 587 gigatons. The amount of carbon based fuels stockpiled ALREADY, by companies such as Exxon-Mobil and Peabody coal is 2800 gigatons. The Keystone Pipeline will be the first environmental test for the Obama Administration. Even if he doesn't go after that project there are other projects in the works to bring tar sands oil to export from the Gulf of Mexico states. Sandy showed our planet is changing. Extremes are the new norm. There is a large measure of psychic-numbing out there. Not to mention poor people in W. Virginia in the coal industry wanting their jobs in coal and being forced by their companies to contribute to Romney super-pacs. Global warming is mutating our planet. It doesn't matter who is to blame. I hope the restored Rex Foundation gives 350.org a grant. There is no place to live, no matter how much money you have, not to be effected by this.
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"A system of conservation based solely on economic self-interest is hopelessly lopsided. It tends to ignore, and thus eventually to eliminate, many elements in the land community that lack commercial value, but that are (as far as we know) essential to its healthy functioning. It assumes, falsely, I think, that the economic parts of the biotic clock will function without the uneconomic parts. It tends to relegate to government many functions eventually too large, too complex, or too widely dispersed to be performed by government. "An ethical obligation on the part of the private owner is the only visible remedy for these situations." – Aldo Leopold
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The essential philosophy of the last Bush Administration was that "God" put the whole planet at our disposal to profit from. The landowner has a moral duty and responsibility to take stewardship. collectively, of that land which he does not own. I see both extremes where I live in Vermont. People who dump their garbage over a hill (it cost money to dispose of garbage, never mind recycle) , into a watershed and people who show up annually for "Green-up Vermont" day and pick up the garbage as well as being active in their local communities about land use all year round.
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Those vowing the Republicans will rise again. Ain't gonna happen unless they learn GOTV (Get Out The Vote). Billions spent by Karl Rove's and Koch's on negative advertizing couldn't defeat the ground operation. There are more people at the bottom than the top. Keep on demonizing, Rush You're pushing them right into our column.
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that voting for the extremist candidate who wants to gut social security, medicare, the epa, and privatize everything in sight -- all paul ryan objectives (and an ayn rand, "atlas shrugged" devotee) -- would be voting for your own demise, but that's just me.
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12 years 7 months
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I think this election has shown the nation what a bag of nuts and bolts the Republican party truly is. The fact that "legitimate rape" was a discussion that made its way to the political stratosphere shows just how out of touch the Conservative brand is from the rest of the nation. Personally, as father to a daughter, there's no way in Hades I'd vote Republican after that kind of talk was entertained. Another big problem we have in this country is the media, and I'm not just talking about Fox News; the media has been allowed to get away with contorting and/or flat-out making up facts to persuade/dissuade the public, and it's appalling. Whatever responsibility to the public the media of yesteryear pledged, that code of ethics and conduct died out long ago. The problem is that they have no one but themselves to answer to, and they are the primary outlet for any and all information the majority of Americans receive on a regular basis. Morale Majority my left foot....
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12 years 2 months
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it's really real....... reality sank in today when i was in my local grocery store, and the hostess section was already wiped out! no more suzy-q creamy particles to wipe off my face no more munchie time, no more lunchie time no more "any" time. hostess produced a fine line of laboratory made, industrial grade survival foods a culinary symphony of sugar, fat, and all things artificial with an ingredient list that only an accomplished chemist could appreciate chewy, gooey and who didn't feel better with a hostess product in their hand? just seeing the box brought about a sense of mild euphoria (i was pavlov's dog, incarnate, at the sight of a fresh suzy-q) not to mention that all hostess products qualified as an important part of a balanced vegetarian diet "the times they are a changin' " this is TRULY sweet - sorrow....... :(
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In case you haven't heard, the latest is Hostess will get a reprieve. All this talk is part of a hardball game between management and unionized bakers. The latest court challenge has rejected management's bankruptcy request...so that means prepare for frosting.
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i hadn't heard. that is definitely good news. ever since friday, i thought that maybe this really was the event the mayans were predicting.i feel cautiously optimistic now.............. maybe there's hope for those store shelves after all. and thanks, mike, for the link.............cool article.
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Been having difficulties with posting lately. Usually I get some kind of timing-out error message, but then when I check, the post is actually there. But right now I'm just filling up space to get rid of the double post that just occurred (I only hit save once, I swear!).
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17 years 2 months
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Twinkies are still being produced in Canada. Road trip!
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14 years 8 months
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Hope everybody out there has a happy, healthy and safe holiday weekend. (PS) Slow down, relax, listen to music in the car, no need to text while driving...
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17 years 2 months
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Happy Thanksgiving y'all! Just made another WAG on 30 Days of November: haven't spent a lot of time on researching the daily selections. Appreciate the "picks" and the fun provided by DL. Sure hope the winter precipitation starts happening in the draught-stricken Rockies and great plains region: Hardly any snow on the mountains at Steamboat this morning.
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14 years 8 months
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The Patriots lost Rob Gronkowski last week to a broken arm and I thought they might have a hard time against the Jets, a divisional rival like the Dolphins that often give them fits. No need to worry. Brady & Company, with superb coaching of Bellichek (His 200th career victory), jacked the Jets, stealing the football 5 times and marching easily up the field on offense to chew up the clock. In the last two games the Pats have scored 59 and 49 points respectively. Their defense ain't nothing to sneeze at either. With a seven and one divisional record, they are going to the playoffs with a first-round bye -- nobody close! Imagine when they are healthy? Gronkowski is due back for the playoffs. This Thanksgiving Day the Lions game was far more interesting to watch.
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The rich got richer and the poor got poorer, while I had a leftover turkey sandwich and graded student essays, which is my plan for today and tomorrow too.
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14 years 8 months
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The election is over and people are trying to breath a sigh of relief. No need to talk about this again. Unfortunately, the fiscal cliff has thrown it back in our face. To be clear, it is about taxes and balancing the budget. The bad news is that it is is a one-sided debate. We have the debate being driven by old-fashioned conservative "balance-the-books" conservatives. Only today the Keynsians have raised their heads to chime in about the debate. The Brits and Europeans have gone through the conservative approach before and have now found themselves bogged down in a double-dip recession. The liberals are now floating more Keynsian ideas that would include the best of Obama's ideas (tax the freakin' rich) close loopholes, raise the capital gains tax to 20% and gut the military-industrial complex. Make cosmetic changes to entitlement programs, mostly making sure the rich can't take advantage of them. Then spend money on creating jobs, mostly by rebuilding America's infrastructure. We could have 4% growth in this country with that policy. The only thing standing in the way is the Republicans. Next time somebody asks you about the "Fiscal Cliff" give them this version or a variant for an answer, don't let somebody else's agenda dominate the debate.
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President Obama has personally approved 2500 drone strikes in his first four years. Talk about karma! Most of the people killed had it coming. They were plotting against us and would kill innocent people. This is a major escalation in the drone method, which allows us to attack enemies in countries where we have not declared war. The Obama administration, it was revealed today, made up rules to make sure the President always has the final say, instead of delegating the responsibility to others. They were afraid of what Mitt might do. People have remarked on the cold steeliness of Barak Obama. He is not a man to be crossed. I think people who doubt his resolve should watch how the Iranian nuke problem plays out...
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Palestine was admitted to the UN as an observer state last week. The entire world, 139 countries, voted for the resolution and two voted against, the US and Israel. Listening to the talking heads justifying the US move made me laugh out loud. The building of Israeli settlements is now the hugest obstacle to peace in the matter and the US insists it is other factors that are to blame. For a better understanding of how the US relates to Israel and against Palestine in this humanitarian tragedy, the building of the largest and most densely populated slum in the world, read Noam Chomsky's words on the subject. I don't have a specific book right off the top of my head, just google it and you'll find multiple words of his on the subject by Chomsky. What is the old saying? Treat other people the way you would like yourself to be treated? Israel should heed those words. Perhaps it wouldn't find itself reviled around the world.
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Royal Dutch Shell has announced publicly that through expansion of fracking shale oil and natural gas production the US will become the world's leading energy producer within ten years. This will in turn produce a manufacturing(!?!) boom in the US as energy is the driving cost factor in sending jobs overseas. It will now be again cheaper for manufacturing (and better for the environment) to be done in the US, most probably in the mid-west. This is a major WOW factor for the US. For the next 100 years we are guaranteed to be the strongest economy on the planet and our political ties to the Mid-East will change forever.
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Because Israel has announced new settlements in Gaza & the West Bank. Imagine in ten years when the US will no longer be that interested in the Middle East? Perhaps the 5 billion dollars a year in foreign aid to Israel can be used for more worthwhile causes within our own country.
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17 years 2 months
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I hope you west coasters are doing okay with all the rain these past few days. The moisture has moved mostly northeast due to the jet stream and the strong gulf air pushing dry air north through the great plains, where we're setting high temp records. We can't buy a raindrop in eastern Kansas. Colorado ski resorts are hurting for snow. What snowfall amounts are registering in the Cascades and Sierras?
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14 years 8 months
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You would be a good one to enter this Dogfish contest.
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I never condone violence. I only highlight this to show how pissed-off people are that the government is going to screw with our medicare and social security benefits, raising the retirement age to 67. Not a done deal you say? We elected Obama and he'll save the day you say? Don't count on it. The Democrats are going to cut a deal eventually that will include these provisions. Why do i know this? Because Democratic spokespeople like Howard dean are saying it already. Screw that and screw the democrats. We worked hard to retire at 65 and and NOBODY should be able to take that from us. All people who have their heads buried in the sand and don't listen to the news or have anything to do with politics? LISTEN! You won't be able to retire at 65 anymore unless you're in the top five percent of income earners. Are you? Do you have a combined income of more than 250k a year and have planned so well for retirement that you don't need these two things? Well aren't you special! I need them. I worked hard for them. This whole drama of the fiscal cliff is a bad morality play with bad actors and a bad script!!!