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When our previous topic hit the 1,000-response mark, sleazy behavior by politicians was eliciting a certain amount of non-astonishment.
well said badger
this self-determination thing, it's not just for us...
Yes
but only the first 3000 Egyptian protesters will get a personalized box set of al-Jazeera commemorative DVD's...
In all seriousness though, self-determination and self-government is a fundamental human right, and hopefully it's that aspect of the American Experiment that catches hold everywhere.
Conversation is always more interesting than recitation, so speak your mind and not someone else's.
Sensible military
That the Egyptian army is refusing to use force against demonstrators is a decision that could spare unnecessary bloodshed, and should be a lesson in democracy to other militaries elsewhere.**********************************
I am not young enough to know everything.
Oscar Wilde
Me Too PID...!
That was hysterical... hahahaha!
Also in seriousness... I'm hoping for as little bloodshed as possible in the civil uprising occurring in Egypt at present. Nothin's "free" and I mean that in too many ways to elaborate but my prayers are with the Egyptian people today and always!
Nice take Badger!
Might be wrong that rad. Islam will step in. But, Yemin's president is going and the King of Jordan has announced something (like, he isn't King next year?)
There are weapons being brandished now by the protesters and some talking heads from the media got hammered by Mubarak's thugs. Mubarak must be raging that his army won't slaughter the masses of his people because his generals know where the guns and money comes from.
The whole Middle East is changing and Israel just woke up and said "Uh-Oh, What the fuck were we thinking not making a peace deal", not that it might not have done any good when your enemies surround now surround you and the only one you could negotiate with, Hamas, is spitting in your face.
PS Badger, only the FW69 & E72 are limited editions!
I'm praying that things calm
that rational minds will find a way...
Amen, J'man
2nd your emotion, definitely...
But there is a piece of me that wants justice and and screams out "HANG EM' HIGH!".
(The people who set up this suffering machine.)
Obviously I have a ways to evolve yet and bow to yout equanimity brother.
Dang, Gonz.....
I humbly say "Thank You". I didn't know you thought so highly of my opinions. Injustice tends to send me off the deep end, also...another man I admire greatly said..."if you want peace, work for justice.."
Unfolding situation in the Middle East
With popular demonstrations and announcements from Egypt continuing (the newest news being the VP may be the ruler of an interim cabinet) the fuse has been lit as Badger outlined more eloquently than I.
The King of Jordan had dissolved his parliament. The president of Yemen has decided not to "run" again. Lebanon is a mess having more to do with other things but still in turmoil. Demonstrations have been planned in Syria where an entire city had been leveled some 20-odd years ago. Sudan and Algeria are showing signs of unrest. Iran is seething and looking for a way to vent it's frustration at the Mullahs.
As Lilly pointed out, this will not end in all extremist Islamic governments. Rather, a vacuum is about to filled by people other than those whom have helped to power. This is a seriously scary situation. Just speculation of oil not going through the Suez canal has raised prices 5-10 cents per gallon (more profit for the oil companies.)
What of Saudi Arabia and Israel in this mess? Both huge power brokers. And the US continues to mass resources, more private mercenaries than trained coalition armies in the region, to deal with matters other than this.
This will be a process unfolding over a long period of time with flare-ups sure to happen. More than ever talks between a coalition and the Iranian government on the peaceful use of nukes are important and must move forward.
I suppose WE don't need to worry, living as we are thousands of miles away, but again, as Badger said, it was the Western nations (and the Kingdom of Saud) who put this god-awful mess together from 1947-1980. We bear responsibility for this and if some madman from Lebanon lobs a nuke bought in Minsk at Tel Aviv we better pray it doesn't start a conflagration we can't contain.
This is more dangerous than people realize. The Bible Prophecy freaks must be going ape-shit right now. Wish I could just turn off the news but I feel like a deer unable to turn away from the headlights.
"All The Dude Ever Wanted...
... was his rug back. It really tied the room together."
The Revolution Will Not Be Televised
As was said on the news tonight from the square (Tairare?) in Egypt, "The Revolution Is Now".
It is do or die for those souls as they know the secret police routinely tortures people, so routinely that the US set up a rendition operation there.
The US & Obama are pushing from one side for Mubarak to get the fuck of Dodge while the House of Saud and Bebe are "Whoa, Slow the fuck down here!"
Meanwhile the Somali's pirated another tanker.
Anarchy is such a merry adventure! (When it doesn't effect you, that is)
Is Superman around? Can we ring-up the bat cave on the cell?
Mubarak to make announcement
Tairare Square has been cordoned off with tanks and razor wire with about 200,000 people locked in with no escape. Mubarak may allow the military to take over and let it crack down in the name of "violating the military curfew".
The hand of the Saudi and Israel is in this now. As Egypt goes, so goes the Middle East..
El Baradai, former Nobel Peace Prize winner in 2005 should take over and appoint a cabinet with the military firmly under his hand.
~ The shit has his the fan ~
Egyptian Army to rule behind VP Sulman
The Army is pushing in on Tahrir Square and has just made it known that they will be in control behind the VP Sulman. If the Square doesn't clear after Mubarak's speech stepping down, expected within the hour, the army may use force to clear the square.
Could be a blood=bath as the protesters don't trust Sulman.
How will 200,000 ordinary Egyptians speak with one voice?
May peace prevail in the coming hours in Egypt.!
Mubarak defiantly stays
Here comes the blood-bath. The mood in the Square has turned ugly. The escalation into violence by the army is unquestionable.
He could have done the noble thing and took a flight into exile but at 82 years old, with billions of dollars of US aid in foreign bank accounts, he chose to debase himself.
The rest of the foreign nations of the Middle East in turmoil want time to turn this thing around and may have emboldened Mubarak. That is almost certainly the case.
The US trained the middle and upper echelons of the Egyptian army and now we are standing with egg on out face. Freedom and liberty? Think again Obama! The angry mob is ready to riot and it doesn't matter where the money came from or who trained the army/
~ You can't depend on your family
You can't depend on your friends
You can't depend on a beginning
You can't depend on an end
You can't depend on intelligence
You can't depend on a god
You can only depend on one thing
You need a Busload of Faith to get by
You can depend on the worst always happening
You can depend on a murderer's drive ~
Progress report please Mr.Lamagonzo?
On October 1st, 2010 lamagonzo said: re: Tigers in the Himalaya
"What I meant was I need to talk to some experts, academic and otherwise, for a couple of months and write a coupe of grant proposals that have a 75% or better shot of working before I can even BEGIN the project."
How did that go, did your idea ever come to fruition? Were you able to stop the illicit trade of endangered tiger species yet? How far have you gotten in "choking off the trade in illicit tiger parts"? Inquiring minds want to know! TIA
Grant ptoposals
There is currently no money out there for grants to save the tiger from poachers who sell to the illicit "medicine" to the Chinese and other markets.
The fear of tigers in Nepal is a long-standing tradition. There is even an old board game where you move tigers and goats around. The last animal left wins. So villagers protecting their goats will always kill the tigers. "Baghchall" is the name of the game.
Even with the money, as you know, it would be long, uphill fight to dsop the profit motive and primal fear of the tiger.
Big cats do abound in the Himalaya though.. Snow leopards and such are plentiful in Bhutan and along the mountain barrier between the Himalayan countries.
One understands the primal fear of the villagers as opposed to the profit motive of poaching for pseudo medicinal parts. I will concede that even with grant money it would be a long, long uphill battle to stop the deliberate hunting of tigers.
Scientists and NGO are not well respected in Nepal. They tend to take the majprity of the grant money and run around the the Kathmandu Valley in SUVs,
Mubarak leaves cairo with family
8;05am, EST -- Unofficial Report
Mubarak and family did the slinky and left Cairo in the early hours of the morning. Good Riddance Hosni.
Now, the Palestinians and Israelis. Jordanians and Yememnese. Let us hope the Yememnese go secular and knock the New Mexican off his perch El-Awalocki.
This is unconformed and unofficial.
for those of you on FB
This page has been really great for communicating with Egyptians on the streets directly. Not to mention 860,000 more peace-loving citizens of the world:
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/event.php?eid=126197157451259
**********************************
I am not young enough to know everything.
Oscar Wilde
An exhilarating
And a volatile and dangerous time for the Egyptian people and everyone in the region. Let's keep the good vibes going and hope that they aren't facing a trade of "the devil they know" for something worse. Let freedom ring!
Love this one!
http://www.ismubarakstillpresident.com/**********************************
I am not young enough to know everything.
Oscar Wilde
won't get fooled again
Let's hope hope hope that Pete T is not right, but this song is an eerie warning.
We'll be fighting in the streets
With our children at our feet
And the morals that they worship will be gone
And the men who spurred us on
Sit in judgment of all wrong
They decide and the shotgun sings the song
I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around me
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
And I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again
Don't get fooled again
Change it had to come
We knew it all along
We were liberated from the fall that's all
But the world looks just the same
And history ain't changed
'Cause the banners, they all flown in the last war
I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around me
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
And I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again
Don't get fooled again
No, no!
I'll move myself and my family aside
If we happen to be left half alive
I'll get all my papers and smile at the sky
For I know that the hypnotized never lie
Do ya?
There's nothing in the street
Looks any different to me
And the slogans are replaced, by-the-bye
And the parting on the left
Is now the parting on the right
And the beards have all grown longer overnight
I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around me
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
Then I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again
Don't get fooled again
No, no!
YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!
Meet the new boss
Same as the old boss
King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia has his head up his ass
In response to the Eqyptian revolution, King Abdullah decides on massive denial tactic:.
Calling the protesters in Cairo and Alexandria "infiltrators," Saudi Arabia's King Abdullah made clear that his allegiance in this crisis is to Mubarak and law and order.
"Egypt is a country of Arabism and Islam," Abdullah said, according to the Saudi Press Agency. "No Arab and Muslim human being can bear that some infiltrators, in the name of freedom of expression, have infiltrated into the brotherly people of Egypt, to destabilize its security and stability and they have been exploited to spew out their hatred in destruction, intimidation, burning, looting and inciting a malicious sedition."
As for online "sedition," the kingdom has shown it has no qualms with pulling the plug on Facebook should it ever feel the need.
If Abdullah is losing his shit maybe Israel, Syria and Iran will have their 4th horsemen to start the apocalypse.
Has the rapture started yet??
per the current news reports
King Abdullah's going peaceful transition woohoo, conveniently failing to mention how it came about. Considering the circumstances...
Protests start up again in Iran today
With usual the result, massive crackdown by well-armed troops.
One starts to see the pattern emerging here. Where the army is faithful to the regime and wiling to fire on it's own people there is little chance of change.
In the case of Egypt, America had so many of the Egyptian army going through the military academies and defense contractors (so they could learn to fire the ordnance we sold them)
they built up a bit of a professional soldier's code.
Not so in most of the rest of the Middle East. Perhaps it will take 100 years to bring a total change, Hope not.
4.5 quake near Koblenz
I see on the news a "mild" earthquake has occurred in west Germany. Are you still shakin' TL?
She hasn't mentioned anything in FB, ted
so I'm thinkin' she's alright.....
I was emailing with an old colleague of mine
who's a US citizen now, but was born in the Middle East and has family all over the region, including Israel, and she says, you think I'm going to talk politics on Facebook? Are you insane?
in fact
on the local TV news last night, it was a story in itself, how the local Iranian-Americans politely but firmly refused to talk to local media at all because anything they said would be back in Tehran getting family in trouble in a heartbeat. The Internet as two-edged sword.
Anything
you say can and will be used against you. Here or abroad, apparently.
Hopefully one day all people everywhere will feel comfortable expressing themselves no matter where they are, and be prepared to respect the point of view of every one else whether they agree with them or not.
Conversation is always more interesting than recitation, so speak your mind and not someone else's.
N. Africa protest spreads...
...and rulers of repressive regimes shoot to kill, kidnap, turture, rape and generally put on the status quo --
Algeria: Violent crackdown on protesters
Libya: Khadaffy rants with usual deadly malice
Syria: Don't even think about it
Jordan: The King moves -- Too little, too late
Israel: Little is being said (Better disarray among your enemies than array)
Iran: The usual assortment of jagg-offs calling for death to protesters
Bahrain: (Home of the US 5th Naval Fleet) Massive crackdown with shotguns, concussion grenades and thuggery to clear the main square overnight. The US fairly occupies Bharain and will never let it go.
Not much of this is different except the extent, broadcast content and the beating and raping of Western journalists.
I think it's time to nationalize the oil companies and use their profits to turn to alternative fuels. This part of the world is fucked for the next 100 years at least with 100,000,000 of the population under the age of 18.in a struggle to rearrange their economic exertions.
Mr. Pid: -- I applaud the current nonviolent efforts of these people under colonial dictators to free themselves and from my relative position am not afraid to say so.
~ Get up, Stand up. Stand up for your rights ~
Huge solar flare
About to hit your neighborhood. Particularly disturbing was this tidbit that I saw in one report, about potential consequences if the Big One hits:
A 2009 report by a panel of scientists assembled by NASA said that a sustained and powerful solar flare outbreak could overwhelm high-voltage transformers with electrical currents and short-circuit energy grids.
The report, titled "Severe Space Weather Events -- Understanding Societal and Economic Impacts" warned that such a catastrophic event could cost the United States alone up to two trillion US dollars in repairs in the first year -- and it could take up to 10 years to fully recover.
I could be typing along and have this whole electronic world of ours collapse without warni
Last grid effected by solar flare...
....was in Quebec. Solar flare breakouts seem to come about every 5 years
Well, I best go out and buy a top-o-the-line genny to make sure my E72 box works besides in the car.
Guess the Chinese are wasting their efforts hacking into our grids. Think I'll go back to my Project Ra and control the sun!
Bunga Bunga anybody?
Silvio Berlusconi done it this time. Famous for picking up virgins and underage whores and having "Bunga-Bunga" parties that are nothing more than orgies w/o date rape or other types of drugs he is up on a rape charges for a 17 year old.
What is about Rome and orgies?
This time he is screwed. His trial is being fast-tracked before a panel of three female judges. The man had no sense of proportion and honey-dipped golden cojones, till now!
~ I can tell you fancy, I can tell you plain
You give something up for everything you gain
Since every pleasure's got an edge of pain
Pay for your ticket and don't complain ~
goats gonz?
skin em' lama..........then wave it wide and high.God bless America and the rest of the free world!
Are there any 99ers out in dead land
I was wondering if any of the Deadheads are 99ers and how they are dealing with the mess our "elected leaders have put us in. I baby sit for a three year old girl who loves the deadand can sing Box of Rain from start to finish. I will get by but something has to change in this country. Boy do we need Jerry now.
99ers unite! (means your unemployment ran out)
Especially in the rust belt. The pictures from Wisconsin are sobering. We CAN'T lose the right to collective bargaining.
I'm happy for all who have a great job, great 401k, great inheritance and don''t give a fig about their social security (while some caustic repubs. are trying to obfuscate an issue that needs a minor fix to provide benefits at current levels for the next 50 years).
I'm all for peace, love and brotherhood
~ But we gotta share some of yours cause we done shared all of mine ~
Libyans diplomatic core defecting...
citizens closing in on Tripoli, Khadaffy's son calls for genocide of the Libyan people.. Bahrain is a freaking mess, wouldn't be surprised to see US troops in the street there.
[sea] star?
I knew someone would come along and give u answers to your questions because I surely couldnt..............Im.....all confused.......