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    marye
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    Bolo24 says: An Idea, Perhaps? Since we're all going to have a fair amount of spare time on our hands for the foreseeable future, what about starting another thread where we all listen to the same show/release on a given day and then share impressions afterward? Folks can submit suggestions and one person (not me) picks what we'll all listen to - call it Deadnet Picks or something. Anyway, if this idea is deemed to have merit, I'd suggest one of the loyal regular posters take the lead and do the picking - y'all can decide who. Might be fun. If it does go forward, I nominate Dick's Picks 18 for the first listen. Been talked about here lately, and, had it been a single show rather than a compilation, we'd probably be talking about it in the same conversation as Cornell, Veneta, etc. Or perhaps even Gainesville?? Stay safe and healthy, friends - this planet needs as many Deadheads as possible.

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  • #991
    bluecrow
    Joined:
    7/10/70 Fillmore East

    With apologies, a calendar suggestion - 7/10/70 Fillmore East - only circulating source is an audience and they clap. No matter. A bit of fire-breathing dragon. Yowza wowza. Billy's drum solos seem crazy loud even back in the balcony. Given the audience source maybe not for the faint of heart.

    Jim - no better place than the river when its hot!

    July '78 box is pure gold (as you all know). My favorite 1st Set ever may be 7/7/78. The Cold Rain and Snow to open Set II is my all-timer. And a little earlier the Eyes from 6/8/77 is a jewel, with that beautiful extended intro, on and on and on.

  • #992
    Oroborous
    Joined:
    We b groovin’ here

    BTK, are you familiar with Wolfgang’s vault? I’ve not done more than peak in, but my understanding is there’s quite the stash that would probably be very pleasurable to your tastes. Daverock too!

    And speaking of, don’t let my picky “opinions” put you off DR. Their great shows, just feel, comparatively, that there might be other, perhaps slightly under the radar (but some on Dicks) shows that are top notch. But that does not mean these are not very enjoyable!

    Great Minds, Ha! Had 7/5/78 on while I finished Reading One Way Out by Alan Paul.

    Water Heals Amigo! Sounds like you’ve shock the cobwebs (and winter beer fat ; ) and are getting yer river on!
    Glad to hear it! Exactly what the doctor orders!
    Hey-O, onward!

  • #993
    billy the kiddd
    Joined:
    9/23/70 Allman Brothers

    There is a great video of the Allman Brothers doing Whipping Post from 9/23/70 . Why is this important? Because the Dead played there 9/17,18, 19, & 20/70, maybe they video taped the Dead and these tapes exist. That would be the ultimate if that was the case. This video was probably shot by the Fillmore East staff, and the same was done for the Dead.

  • #994
    daverock
    Joined:
    7/5/78

    Another sparkling show - maybe the best band performance of the first three shows in this collection. Keith seems more present at this one. I like the sound of these shows as well as the playing - very strong and clear. I get the impression they were quite loud if you were there.
    As the 73 box is due tomorrow, I think I will save the Red Rocks shows for a bit. Maybe next weekend.
    Looking at the posts on the 73 board it's fingers crossed for tomorrow! Reading Oro's post below, I would think these shows are just too long to be top drawer all the way through. I'm really looking forward to hearing them all - but these long 73 shows all had some slow moments from what I have heard.

  • #995
    JimInMD
    Joined:
    Spirit

    That's the spirit.. I am sure they have looked at everything they have and are spreading things out to last.

    Speaking of 1980, like many I really liked Dave's Picks 8. Great sound, spirited show.. worthy.

    Well.. I've been in my kayak everyday for about a week.. I'm comletely spent and recharging my batteries today listening to a little fine 1978 GD.

    Thanks for lifting my spirits Oro and BTK. I guess there are plenty of good shows to come. I hope they still have a trick or three up their sleeves too. Things we might not know exist or do not expect. It's kind of cruel to drop a '69 banana box on us and never hear another mention, don't you think?

  • #996
    billy the kiddd
    Joined:
    Future boxes

    Winter land Oct 1978 Great shows, & Winter land March 1977 great shows, two future boxes.

  • #997
    Oroborous
    Joined:
    Jim’s back with a big blast

    Street legal? I didn’t think public consumption was legal anywhere, technically of course, now in reality…

    Carful about splinters on that flag pole, bet there’s a nice breeze up there though!

    78 box. I didn’t get cause I turned my nose up “ohhh, I don’t need that…” IDIOT!
    Prolly pissed that it wasn’t something i “wanted”? Whatevs…idiot!
    That and I knew I could get copies off my cousin…, but still, IDIOT!
    I do have copies so I’ve heard it, and at first was like meh. But after “discovering” spring 78 and how much I liked it, I’ve come to a different realization of the year and box, but…but, I should spend some more time, just when…?

    Made it through 73 box once so far. Haven’t been getting the best listens in (these shows are so long) and it’s just not a good time of year to completely clear mind and listen hard for 4 or 5 hours.

    I think the sound is mostly great, the art was nice, and the shows are good, (the packaging was not practical) but I respectfully disagree that their all top shelf. They all have moments, but I didn’t feel like they were at that level for the whole show, which is why I wouldn’t call em all top shelf…so, a solid enjoyable box from one of my favorite years, but I think there’s still better…

    So, I respectfully disagree that we’re running out of high caliber shows, definitely diminished but, consider just some of these: first and foremost I’d say the first six shows of 73 are as good or better than these. 2/9 is good, but way overhyped due to years of taper bias. I think it’s as good as most of the shows in the box, but not as good as the other five, but would be a good center point of a very strong box!
    I still think there’s good primal, though why they won’t break out I can’t fathom…
    There’s still some killer shows from late 71 after KG joined…certainly some hot spring shows too, but not sure they’d sell as well?
    There’s still some killer fall 72, though you’d think they’d wait on that a bit!
    A plethora of 73! Winter, spring, summer, fall…(ok, prolly will never see a horn tour box) but some representation would be nice. I still say Providence, or Syracuse would make a nice WOTF 50th bonus since their killer shows and have the most songs off the album (6 I think?).
    Unless they did a Winterland 74 redo (which I don’t see), 74 prolly doesn’t have a box left.
    76 could do another summer box
    77 I hope not as it’s over represented, comparatively, but I’m sure there’s some small holes still
    78: Spring still has some great shows, some Betty’s, and possibly fall, but I’m not as up on those yet?
    79…? not sure about a box? If they made it a 79 box of the whole year, than absolutely!
    80, same thing. Of course that’s predicated on Fall tapes not being available…otherwise!
    I could name lots of 80s, especially early, but of course that means cassettes, which to some immediately discounts or outright disqualifies…to each there own. I think their getting pretty damn good at fixing them up, but whatevs…
    Still hope someday, unfortunately I don’t see it soon, but someday we’ll get a summer 85.
    86 through 88, prolly not, though when we’re gone or not as involved, maybe they’ll market something 87 for all the touchers? Of course if they did more venue boxes, i.e., Greek, Frost etc, many of these could come into play

    But!!, but, there is still a fine trove of untapped Multies from 89, especially the fall tour (wtf Dave?) and lots of good DATs from the nineties which did have some consistently good tours: summer 90, fall 91, summer 91, some call out spring 91, but I’ve not spent enough time there yet to opinion?
    I could argue others, but I don’t see it from a marketing standpoint?
    I’m sure heads are spinning and many would argue otherwise. But I’ve put the time in, and if you strip the preconceived pretentious BS and just listen, you’d be surprised.
    And though there may NOT be enough good/consistent left for a lot of boxes, there’s tons of individual and small runs, that are very good GD. Hell, they could always do another 30 trips, say for the 60th in gulp, 2 years!
    I mean, I get what yer saying, but the more I dig through the years, all the years, I’m still finding juicy nugs of goodness, even some hiding up there where mama hides the cookies!
    Be well, stay cool all!
    In fact, stay inside where it’s cool, and PLAY DEAD!

  • #998
    JimInMD
    Joined:
    July '78

    What a surprise that box was.. love that box. The June '76 recordings seemed to be on the same level (excellent) but the energy was not quite there.

    So we have two May '77 Betty Boxes (both excellent) and a June '76 and July '78 box (again, both excellent with a big nudge going to 1978). With Spring '73 and October '72 boxes released, I hate to say it but I am not sure I see a long stream of shows at this high caliber. Let's hope Dave has some more surprises up his sleeve.

    It's been so damned hot here in the East the last week.. and with my air conditioner on the fritz, the only way I could find to break the heat was to take off all my clothes and perch myself on the top of the telephone pole in the town park. Looking at temperatures across the county (and globe), I expect many of you were in the same predicament.

    I'm going to hit some of the July box this afternoon.. might start with the second set of 7/5 and work my way backwards to 7/1. 7/7 and 7/8 deserve special treatment and a large span of uninterrupted time.

    oh.. Maryland went legal on 7/1. It did not take long for at least the streets in the mountainous parts to smell like a Grateful Dead Concert.. was that haze in the sky residual smoke from the Great Canadian fires of 2023 or celebratory smoke signals from the newest state to go street legal? I never expected this to happen in my lifetime.. little by little they are decriminalizing the freak flag.

    Happy summer all.. thanks for keeping up the good vibes and keeping the picks on-point.

  • #999
    wilfredtjones
    Joined:
    Omaha!

    Always dug that and considered it the sleeper. All Over Now, check that out. As Jim would say, Wowow stuff. Also, the meat of set II is where it's at. Of course, the Weirdness>Wharf Rat but that whole set II jam sequence is powerhouse stuff. Plus, don't they encore with Promised Land? May be sui generis, only time that happened. Anyway, great stuff with the Oroboros sculpture in the back watchin' over things... :-)

  • #1000
    1stshow70878
    Joined:
    7-3-78

    When this was first released I said this was the sleeper of the batch. SO damn good and under the radar. Having heard 2 of the 5 shows already 7-3 impressed me the most at the time and still is impressive.
    The July '78 box is the best box design of the lot IMO.
    Cheers
    7-8-78 cued up on the tape deck. Aside from the tape flip the late-90s bootleg CD source was superb sound. Easily equal to the official release. In some ways better in that I can hear the amps buzzing right before the 2nd set begins.

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Bolo24 says: An Idea, Perhaps? Since we're all going to have a fair amount of spare time on our hands for the foreseeable future, what about starting another thread where we all listen to the same show/release on a given day and then share impressions afterward? Folks can submit suggestions and one person (not me) picks what we'll all listen to - call it Deadnet Picks or something. Anyway, if this idea is deemed to have merit, I'd suggest one of the loyal regular posters take the lead and do the picking - y'all can decide who. Might be fun. If it does go forward, I nominate Dick's Picks 18 for the first listen. Been talked about here lately, and, had it been a single show rather than a compilation, we'd probably be talking about it in the same conversation as Cornell, Veneta, etc. Or perhaps even Gainesville?? Stay safe and healthy, friends - this planet needs as many Deadheads as possible.
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Submitted by fourwindsblow on Sun, 04/26/2020 - 14:30

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Now when I go shopping I look like the uni-bomber hood up glasses on mask I'm afraid to go to the bank.

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Submitted by icecrmcnkd on Sun, 04/26/2020 - 14:31

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One typo, 3-22-93 was in ATL not Oakland. Don’t know how this site got that wrong.
Oh wait, not surprised that this site has errors.

7-31-74, Promised Land just ended, I have a lot to look forward to while cooking. Probably time for some beer.

....es no bueno. Plenty of alcohol though. Whew!
11.10.73 Bob T says? Twist my joint.
The Kinks were incredible. Every album is different! You go Davies Bros! Reminds me of another band. Too bad they fought so much.

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Submitted by Vguy72 on Sun, 04/26/2020 - 14:45

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....is a pic from the 7.31.74 booklet. Look at Garcia leaning back and blowing everyone's minds!! Yup. Kinda like that! Lookit him loving on Wolf.

I wasn’t saying to listen to it tomorrow, I was saying “Hey Dave, how about 12-18-73 for DaP36?”
But that doesn’t mean that you can’t listen to it tomorrow after 11-10-73.

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Submitted by icecrmcnkd on Sun, 04/26/2020 - 15:38

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You’re so lucky to live in a cool state.

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Submitted by Vguy72 on Sun, 04/26/2020 - 15:45

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....list shows attended. Pour some good bourbon, light a preroll and go!
Nevada is a cool state, Vegas mayor notwithstanding.
Prepping the grill for ribeyes.
I fear for my home city though.
I still have Primus tix for July in Vegas.
LMG says 10.6.20 will be a date to focus on. Kept it short and sweet. We shall see.

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Submitted by Thats_Otis on Sun, 04/26/2020 - 15:56

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My vote is for the Winterland show, though Curtis is incredible.

Maybe some Pig and/or Brent shows going forward?

Peace

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Submitted by bob t on Sun, 04/26/2020 - 16:45

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Bolo so incredibly envious i think is the word.... 11/10/73, first show wow!! Playing>Uncle John's>Morning Dew>Uncle John's>Playing, I think I would have passed out!!! Did you go the next night??? bob t

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Submitted by DeadVikes on Sun, 04/26/2020 - 16:57

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Still working my way through this monster. Love the Scarlet opener. Great first set. Nice China Rider. Love the Eyes, WPS.

Every time I listen to this show, I always think the fidelity is just a little off. Doesn't seem to match some of the other 74 releases like Dick's 31, RT2
2.3 or Dave's 9, the May MT show, which are all A+ in sound quality. What do you all think? Do I have a bad copy?

Winterland 73, wow Bolo that is pretty cool that was your first show.
I am in on 11/10/73 for tomorrow.

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Submitted by Vguy72 on Sun, 04/26/2020 - 18:00

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....I'm representing the Big Rock Pow Wow 5.23-24.1969. Road Trip Vol 4. No 1. I was one year old. Makes sense to me. Music to be birthed by.
You want the grease? There ya go.
Jimbo is especially fond of this release. Hard to argue.
If there are rules to this endeavor, I might have just broken them.

....was ahead of the curve.
Nuances. Jerry flutters the strings at the 1:50 mark of BE Women.....getting settled here.

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Submitted by The Good Ole G… on Mon, 04/27/2020 - 07:20

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11/10/73 - Fine start with Bertha, Jerry's solo says it's gonna be a good night out of the box.

BOLO tell us a first show story!

And when you say "official" show, is there un-official shows? Just trying to be hip, on all the jive;)

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Submitted by fourwindsblow on Mon, 04/27/2020 - 07:44

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Bertha grooving I can see Bolo dancing, Jack, Loser into a beautiful LLR, Deal still climbing, nice Mexicali, wonderful Tenn Jed & El Paso, Fair Thee Well I want to cry, BIODTL, hoping Row J, and Weather Report takes me home.

Set 2 dives right into the deep end. Stella Blue, Truckin' are they teasing Nobodys Fault, psychedelic Wharf Rat

I remember listening to this run when I first got it 11/9 I thought was great, the 10th was okay some nice parts played very well. I think they were holding back some so they could blow everyone's minds on the 11th. It's played with enough energy to carry from 9 into the incredible 11.

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Submitted by Thats_Otis on Mon, 04/27/2020 - 09:04

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... As you can see, being a rock n' roller ain't no bed of roses.

Love these guys! 11/10/73 commencing.

Peace

Set 1 was a real nice trip.

iTunes is telling me I haven't listened to this since 10/11/13 @ 12:41pm & I'm thinking I was probably pretty toasted then based on the time..

I'm really getting a lot out of these revisits... so many days between.

Crazy to think that in 2008 this was the 2nd big Box Set of a run of shows released. Previously planned for 2006 release, who remembers waiting?

Brokedown Palace 1 of 7 from '73.. real good.
Weather Report Suite was so good too.
(little tape flutter I'm hearing in there?).

Time for a Set Break.

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Submitted by JimInMD on Mon, 04/27/2020 - 11:05

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What show are we doing today, Winterland 73 or Big Rock Pow Wow? I'm so confused...

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Submitted by fourwindsblow on Mon, 04/27/2020 - 12:17

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I would be right at home at this one. Can't wait till tomorrow.

This site thinks I'm a robot. Do I look like a robot?

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Submitted by fourwindsblow on Mon, 04/27/2020 - 12:21

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I got a rabbit sits out front of the house everyday listening to the tunz. Them must be some good picks.

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Submitted by Strider 808808 on Mon, 04/27/2020 - 12:39

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Dillon Stadium had some kind of dynamic effect on the band. Exploratory China Cat /I Know you Rider . , think about 50 year anniversary of Harper College May 2 next Saturday . Considered one of the most amazing Dead concerts of all time.
Mark me down for Seminole Powwow, Alligator land.

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Submitted by DeadVikes on Mon, 04/27/2020 - 14:56

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November 73 is so damn good. This show is awesome. Again, the focused listen to get through the whole show in one day is fun. I will be checking out 11/9 and 11/11 again this week as well.
Sound quality is A+. First Plangent Box, what a great job and partnership with Dave and crew.

Always like hearing a Brokedown Palace. Of course the Playing/UJB/Dew/UJB/Playing sandwich is epic.

Great finish. Big River, Stella Truckin, etc. Casey Jones encore.

And you were there Bolo, wow! What a unbelievable first show.

Great Pick!
Thanks a lot folks.

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Submitted by bolo24 on Mon, 04/27/2020 - 15:43

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The sea was angry that day, my friends.

My brother and I arrived at the corner of Post and Steiner, queueing up to enter the vaunted Winterland Arena. It was my birthday present from him, and the first time I'd seen the Dead since 1/14/67, the Human Be-In (thats a whole 'nother story).

As we're waiting to go in, my brother ran into a college buddy of his, Dell Furano, who was working for Bill Graham at the time. He and his brother would go on to form Winterland Productions with Graham the following year.

Anyway, Dell decided that we should see the show from a unique vantage point - a wooden light/camera box perched on the side of the wall with a great view of the band, stage right. We had to climb up a less-than-stable wooden ladder mounted on the wall, and I'm pretty certain we and other friends of the Furanos exceeded the legal weight capacity of said box by at least 200%.

As the show went on, any beer that was confiscated at the front doors mysteriously found its way up to our little box. It was a pretty steady supply for the duration.

During the set break, we found ourselves in the middle of a spontaneous drum circle in the lobby. We were chanting and banging on anything we could find - trash cans, empty beer bottles, etc. After several minutes, a rather large security dude came toward us and pulled a wooden baton out of a hip holster. I thought we were in for it, but he just joined in, banging on a concrete column and grinning widely. The whole scene was as cool as one could possibly imagine - complete bliss!

After the famous Playin' sandwich to launch the second set, well, that was it for me. Plaster from the old ceiling was literally raining down on us as Phil dropped bomb after bomb, and I was in heaven - I'd officially found my seat on the bus!

After the show we hung around for a bit with a few folks, waiting until I felt it was OK to drive. I remember leaving through a side door, and I paused for a couple seconds and peeked out the door, because I wasn't entirely convinced that I was walking outside to the same planet Earth I'd departed a few hours earlier. Turns out my instincts were correct - the world would never look or feel or sound the same to this day. I, like all of you, was granted the extreme privilege of peeking behind the curtain. The soundtrack to my life had been established once and for all, and it's been a glorious journey ever since.

The End.

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Submitted by The Good Ole G… on Mon, 04/27/2020 - 16:33

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From where I was standing, I could see directly into the eye of the great fish.

A Great and Well told story!

You just can’t beat that, thank you sir.

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Submitted by fourwindsblow on Mon, 04/27/2020 - 16:54

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"Mammal." "Whatever!"

11/9 Takes most of set 1 to get it dialed in, some roughs spots here and there China> Rider, Playin' pretty good. HCS to open set2.

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Submitted by Thats_Otis on Mon, 04/27/2020 - 17:38

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The "Brokedown" is gorgeous, that whole 2nd disc is great, and the "Wharf Rat" is glorious. It was fun to dive into the boys towards the beginning of 73 (DiP28) and towards the end. What a great year!

I have (surprisingly) never listened to Big Rock, as I missed nearly all of the Road Trip series on the original go through, but I have found a way to stream it - looking forward to hearing what all of the hype is about!

Peace

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Submitted by Vguy72 on Mon, 04/27/2020 - 20:27

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....consists of beer brats with medium cheddar wrapped in crescent rolls and portobello mushrooms in a butter/garlic sauce with thyme and parmesian.
Looking for a chateau, 21 shrooms and one to go.
It works.
I'm no cook, but I spent last night at a Holiday Inn. Evens out.
Onto the second set.
Oh. And a merlot.

11/10/73 - Kidd Candelario’s tricked out 2-Track recording of Winterland ’73 along with Bolo24’s wonderful tale and copious recounts and reviews from GD scholars & fans took me there!

Said to be “maybe” the best 2-Track recordings from ’73 in the Vault quality wise

Set 2 Absolutely Rocks and the 1st of 3 PITB > UJB > Morning Dew > UJB > PITB palindrome is definitely the highlight. The rest of the set really sparkles too.
Really rockin’ Big River, nice Stella, top notch Truckin’ > Wharf > Sugar Mags, OMSN.
One of my favorite moments you ask?
Right before the Encore you hear a fan call for “Casey Jones!” and then “Drivin’ That Train…”
Ah.. Winterland that hallowed hall, I wish I knew you!

Ask and you shall be rewarded, right Bolo24?

Such a great first show story. Thanks again for sharing, I liked that firsthand account as much as the revisit, and the two together… Extra Sweet!

Yet another reason ’73 is mentioned as a “best” year for the GOGD.

Alright, onward you say? 5/23 & 24 of 1969 you say? Well, well, well…

After yesterdays revisit of '73 I'd like to hear that 11/11/73 Dark Star again & 11/17/73 DaP V5 Palindrome #2 again

So I’ll toss those two out to the wind and let’s see if they make it into our little revisit list..

But until then I will go with you all to the cosmic year of 1969!

PS - If no-one wants to listen to the two shows mentioned above 11/11/73 & 11/17/73 then, lmk cause I’ll listen to those in my “spare” time;)

ICECRMCNKD - 12/19/73 Complete Show Re-Issue / ReMaster. YES Please!!!

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Submitted by Thats_Otis on Tue, 04/28/2020 - 07:57

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Commencing now.

"Hard to Handle" right outta the gate!

Looking forward to this one... I'll be sure to keep my hands out of my pockets.

Also, got my shipping notice for Jai-Alai - looks like delivery by end-of-day Friday. Good stuff.

Peace

EDIT: Just saw that according to our friend Doc, 4/28/71 may be the best show in GD history. Well, I know what I am going to put on after the Pow Wow!

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Submitted by unkle sam on Tue, 04/28/2020 - 08:43

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What a show the 23rd is, how many times did they do St. Stephen>the Eleven outta Dark Star? This is a really good Dark Star and a very nice Morning dew, what's not to like. Plus I think this is the first Casey Jones. I have been to the Seminole Indian Reservation, went to the Phish show down there for the 1999 new years run, but that's a different story. I can only imagine how desolate and out in the middle of nowhere this show must have been, must have been a gas to drive on Alligator Alley to get to this show. I've also seen Alligators and Indians and have experienced Orange Sunshine, just not all together at the same time :)

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Submitted by fourwindsblow on Tue, 04/28/2020 - 11:42

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10 was dialed in so from Bertha on the sound was there maybe a few tweaks here and there, they were really able to hear each other very well kinda like 8-24-72 where you can hear all the nuances, and the band played very well. I made it to Eyes from the 9th it was late and things didn't seem to be clicking.

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Submitted by bob t on Tue, 04/28/2020 - 11:43

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Pigpen just heckles the shit out of the announcer.... "You ain't if you don't shut up!!" Listen closely if you never have... I threw a quote out from this show when i requested to listen to the Dave's Wichita 72 show, "Don't be programming it baby let's just get it on!!""" bob t

Running a little late, just getting into Set I of of 11-10-73. Bolo, that's quite the Origin Story!! Such a fun vivid picture to have painted for this collective listen. Wow, the sound is dialed in from the get go. Gorgeous. Another great pick o' the day. Disc 3 from the next night was in the road music rotation for a good while, but even that seems like ages ago. Looking forward to the Big Rock Pow Wow - that sequence with He Was A Friend Of Mine is sweet!

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Submitted by fourwindsblow on Tue, 04/28/2020 - 12:00

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The Spirit's are alive! The Katcinas here.

This show sound dialed I can hear everything twice the band is playing great, Dark Star through the roof. What i like most about the era is it goes right into it. Bear was The Sound Man I guess everybody else learned it from him.

When life gives you lemons you go put on Pow Wow from '69.

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Submitted by Thats_Otis on Tue, 04/28/2020 - 12:00

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I enjoyed today's listen - though I must admit that I did not do the back-to-back 30~min. "Lovelights."

"Death Don't" is a track that I need to listen to more often - one of my favorites from the earlier days, and I thought this one was haunting and perfect.

I too was at the Phish 1999 NYE shows in the Everglades, and yes, I did see some gators. What a trip it must have been to be there in 69.

Good stuff. And yes, the band really did seem to give that announcer hell.

Peace

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Submitted by fourwindsblow on Tue, 04/28/2020 - 12:19

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Sounds real nice. I hope that the 24th sounds good too but this Lovelight is pretty good.