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    clayv
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    "To my ears, the best Dead shows are those that not only fit the criteria that make them amongst the best of a year, but that are also completely unique for their era—shows that fit perfectly into their year of performance, but also fall somewhat outside of the norm for that year. Harpur College, Veneta, Cornell, Cape Cod, and Augusta are all shows that are objectively excellent, and if they are not the best from their respective years of performance, they are certainly unique. Miami 6/23/74 falls into that category: not only one of the very best shows from this outstanding year, but also one of the most interesting and unique. It’s certainly worthy of many, many deep listens." - David Lemieux

    ¡Ándale, ándale! ¡Arriba, arriba! We're back with a hot one from Miami, F-L-A. DAVE’S PICKS VOLUME 34 features the complete show from the Jai Alai Fronton, 6/23/74, one with unparalleled sound quality due in equal parts to the Wall Of Sound and the beautiful sonic clarity of Kidd Candelario's tapes. The first set is chock full of dynamite takes on classics like "Ramble On Rose," "Mississippi Half-Step," and "Cumberland Blues." The second set delivers on the JAMS - one leading into a gorgeous "Ship Of Fools," one rare instrumental version of "Dark Star," and a "Spanish Jam," this is Miami after all! The show also offers up a "first" and an "only" - the former, a Seastones set featuring Phil and Ned Lagin and the latter, the sole Grateful Dead performance of Chuck Berry's "Let It Rock."

    Limited to 22,000 numbered copies, DAVE’S PICKS VOL.34: JAI ALAI FRONTON, MIAMI, FL 6/23/74 has been mastered from the 7.5 IPS reel-to-reel tapes to HDCD specs by Jeffrey Norman. ¡Agarrarlo mientras esta calientito! (Get it while it's hot!)

    *Limited to 2 per order. Very limited quantity available.

    Subscribed to Dave's Picks? With this release, you'll also get a bonus disc with selections from Miami 6/22/74. Excellente!

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  • #1421
    CaseyJanes
    Joined:
    WilfredT UJB

    You are correct sir about the Bm...also a Dm and Dsus2 according to Ultimate Guitar Tabs on the “Official Version”. I love the above mentioned app. Has most every song that you can think of and usually there are many versions to play so if you’re not quite getting one arrangement there is usually a way for guys like me to dumb it down a bit. That said I need to add those chords on UJB as they are in my range. Will also try the riff....I have a little pentatonic game as well! (I’m guessing there)

    For the record, and if memory serves, I do believe I’ve seen youtube of you playing WilfredT, and you are an excellent player. I’m like a wanna be campfire player at best, but it’s more fun then a frog in a glass of milk.

  • #1422
    Oroborous
    Joined:
    Hola Senor Janes

    Good to see ya!
    I think Bob was alluding to what I’ve heard/read all of them say over the years; it got harder and harder to get the band (especially Jerry) to rehearse and some of those songs you just couldn’t do well without rehearsal: LS, Cosmic Charlie, St Stephen etc. Unfortunately another side effect of ole Jer Bears monkey...especially when you consider how hard many of Jer’s parts were on these songs...it’s a bummer but no wonder many of the greats were set aside.

    GUITARS & CADDILACS; used to play all the time. Tried to play guitar for ten years, occasionally professionally, once in the studio....switched to bass and rarely looked back. Did try the solo acoustic/apre thing briefly, but wasn’t that good and it’s really hard carrying the whole show by your self. And Scarry! Don’t have that front man Mojo either “star waaarrrsss, nothing but staaaarrrrr wwwaaaarrrsss” much prefer to play with 3 to 5 people, the interaction is where it’s at. But the rush of playing in a hot band in front of a bunch of people IS uncompareble....talk about a high!
    But yeah, I preferred being in the back row under the dark lights grooving on the Bass. Played that professionally on and off for 20 years, last ten it was my main, though not only job...It was a gas, but after 100-150 nights a year, often at shitty bars and clubs, when your feet are killing you and your back can’t take that heavy lumber anymore, we’ll sometimes it’s a double edge sword doing what you love for a living....unfortunately haven’t really played in like ten years now. Had to TRY and grow up and get a real job....plus after I got booted out of my main gig, eventually all the calls stopped coming as it is a small, close knit group that gets the gigs here.
    I truly miss it in my minds eye, but I don’t miss schlepping that heavy ass gear at 3 in the morning, or getting hassled by the law, or trying to get inspired when your back hurts and it’s late, and there’s only 4 drunks left, but I do miss it.
    GUITARS
    - Ibanez Muscian Series I got in 79 and modified with Alembic circuitry/pickups in 84.
    - Madeira Acoustic
    - 84 Alembic Spoiler 4 string electric Bass
    - Michael Kelly Club Deluxe 5 String Acoustic/Electric Bass. picked this up early century when I was playing a lot to get upright sound etc. Never spent enough on upright to be proficient as it’s physicaly painful, and it’s a drag trying to play live with a loud band. I liked the sound I good get with the Kelly and a Sans Amp tech 21 Acoustic DI. It’s made for Acoustic guitar but works awesome for the Acoustic Bass. Seceret is the adjustable mid....
    shit, ramblin again, sorry, fun topic. DAVEROCK sportin’ the Bobbie Dazzler! Nice axe bra! My guitar teacher always played and sold Gretches. Wish I would of got one, but wanted a Bob Weir Ibenez so bad. Almost had one but got the Muscian series instead. I’ve seen pictures of both Bob and Jerry playing one but not sure what show (s)? Think it was around when Bob was first using Ibenez?

  • #1423
    wilfredtjones
    Joined:
    Casey Janes UJB chords and guitars

    There's a B Minor in there somewhere...I think after the G. The riff is fun, too! Don't forget to learn that :-)

    Thanks for sharing info. on your guitars, too. I also have a '96 Washburn (D-20 in Koa). My brother just bought his first guitar, a Seagull S6... :-)

  • #1424
    Oroborous
    Joined:
    6/22/83 source

    Yeah I think that’s the same source as I had. As I say at the time it was definetly my best sounding tape which in those days wasn’t saying much, but this one shined! Great show too, and looks like it must of been a great place to freak freely from the news clip.
    So my buddy Doug hooked up with some dude who either was doing the taping or ? Not sure I really knew, but they knew WTF they were doing, had like Nac with sennhieser mics and were usually low generation and near that quality.
    I had the best gear so most of my friends/cousins would bring their new tapes to my house for coping etc so I’d usually get decent generations. Some shows better than others depending on where they were located. Remember, this was before taper section so some diehard pros would poach in front of board, which sometimes was awesome, other times too loud or tone unbalanced etc...
    Anyway, we start getting some killer 83’s, probably end of year I’m guessing. Unfortunately I never got the source guys info and next thing you know ole Doug’s knocked up the bosses daughter, whose family is super religious so shotgun wedding and no more fun for ole druggles, poor bastard! And no more tapes for us! Dooaah
    Funny part was he got our band to play his ultra conservative wedding, but’s that’s a whole nother story for the bonfire....

  • #1425
    CaseyJanes
    Joined:
    Guitars and UJB

    Hey all, COVID seems to have me busier than I’ve ever been with both the wife and kid working and schooling here at the cave...so I’ve just been lurking here lately on the site, but I have to jump in on a good guitar convo.

    Dennis, I’ve read that 1983 is right around when Gibson started producing great acoustics again, shifting back to some of the methods that they used on 60s flat top guitars. I would love to play that Hummingbird. I’ll bet it sounds awesome, and from knowing what I know of you, it is probably very well cared for! I just recently learned UJB. It was surprisingly (to me at least) very easy to learn and made up of only 5 basic chords (G, D, C, Am, Em) which are some of the first chords (and easiest) that most guitar players will learn. Rhythmically, the toughest part of the song IMO is probably in what would be considered to be the chorus....that is the part that goes “whoa-o what I want to know is ______________....there are some quick chord changes in that line which take some practice, but all in all, not to difficult. That said, singing it and playing at the same time for me is much more difficult. I have only recently been able to incorporate some singing along with my playing and I have been playing for more than 20 years. Some of that I think is confidence factor of worrying about what others think I sound like, which I really don’t give a shit about anymore, but the other part is that rhythmically it is not easy to learn, especially if the song has difficult chord phrasing. Did anyone hear the Bob Weir Shakedown interview from Friday night? He had some interesting comments about Lost Sailor and the reason it didn’t stay around for too long in the bands repertoire. Too difficult to play and the other band members didn’t want to spend the time on it. And we’ve seen that LS has only recently been brought back into D&Cs repertoire. So this got me thinking about the progression of Bob Weirs playing ability. Of course it’s widely know that Bob was nearly kicked out of the band early on because of complaints about his guitar playing. And to be fair he only started playing guitar at the age of 13 and then met Garcia just 3 years later. And any player is going to experience some plateauing, especially early on. That said, it make me wonder if the shift in style on WMD and AB were at least partly made in efforts to help with this handicap as the arrangements are much simpler and back to the basics. (Here is a quote from wiki on the subject:
    “The incident apparently led to a period of significant growth in Weir's guitar playing. Phil Lesh said that when drummer Mickey Hart left the band temporarily in early 1971, he was able to hear Weir's playing more clearly than ever and "I found myself astonished, delighted and excited beyond measure at what Bobby was doing." Lesh described Weir's playing as "quirky, whimsical and goofy" and noted his ability to play chord voicings on the guitar (with only four fingers) that one would normally hear from a keyboard (with up to ten fingers).[13].

    Cousins: what kind of guitars do you own? What gets the most play? Based on your bands genre, I’m going to guess a Fender Telecaster?

    Here are my guitars:

    1). 1996 Washburn Limited Edition Acoustic
    2). 2017 Gibson Les Paul High Performance in Cherry Red Sumburst
    3). Seagull Artist Studio CW Deluxe Element
    4). MJT Custom Telecaster build that is aged vintage relic...Taos Turquoise over 3-Tone burst
    5). Rhino issued Grateful Dead Dancing Bear/Stealie ukulele (don’t really play this one just decoration
    6). I also recently ordered a Taylor GS Mini Koa Plus E with edge burst on my 4 years zero interest Sweetwater card. I needed a good travel guitar and this one gets phenomenal reviews....can’t wait!, but sshhhhhh! Don’t tell Mrs Casey!

    -the one I play the most (currently) is the Seagull...most accessible hanging on the wall right next to the couch in my living room. It has a pick up so I can plug it in but I rarely do as it projects nicely anyway. It as a solid Sitka Spruce Top, with Solid Rosewood back and sides, Mahogany neck and Ebony fingerboard, gold vintage tuners. It’s a beautiful guitar that sounds just as good as it looks.

    Oro - Great repo car story...had me LOL as usual! For those interested, I promise to finish my Gorge story very soon. Fell off the wagon on that one, but the details are still there. Anniversary is also fast approaching....bummed I can’t do the repeat as I planned for Boulder in July...hopefully we can get back at it soon!

    Doc - Great to read your regular posts again. Glad you’re back.

    Be Well Dead People!

    KCJ

    Led Ded: just read your post...couldnt agree more. No better hobby and incredibly gratifying when you are able to overcome a plateau....repitition and practice....I’m at least one hour a day usually early mornings or later at night!

  • #1426
    LedDed
    Joined:
    Yes, some of us really play...

    I am a guitar freak. I have about two dozen electrics, two acoustics and a couple basses, untold effects pedals and several amps. I actually do pick up those instruments with my two hands and play the shit out of them, every day, sometimes only for a half hour and other times all day long, esp. on weekends.

    It's the most gratifying hobby I've ever known. When you start out, you suck and sound like shit. Over time, you learn other people's songs, chord changes, scales, etc. One day you find yourself sitting there with a drink and wailing along to "Layla" at full volume, kicking ass and blending right into the record. And then, you start coming up with your own stuff. Some people eschew covers and play as themselves right off, but if there's a kind of music you like, learning that stuff gives you a toolbox of techniques from which to start doing your own thing.

    You get out of it what you put into it, practice practice practice. I don't really practice so much as play, but you hone your skills through repetition and hours devoted as you pick up new things here and there. One of my favorite things is to crank up a "Big River" like the one on One From The Vault, and wail along with Jerry. He was so good in his prime it's sick.

    I'm not in a band. I have a straight job and a family (and a mortgage etc.) However now and again getting in a room with other musicians, especially with drums present, and turning up is as much fun as it looks. Unfortunately it looks like a bleak time right now for anyone struggling to make it as a musician. First album sales were destroyed by the internet and bands had to depend on live concerts and merch sales. What are they going to do now?

    A long time ago, I might have leaned that way, but I'm glad I went with the straight job, keeping the guitar playing on the side, pure artistic expression with no strings attached or record company bullshit. Last, anyone who's always wanted to learn to play the guitar, go buy a decent one and get after it! If you keep with it, it will reward you more than you can imagine.

    \m/

  • #1427
    Deadheadbrewer
    Joined:
    Did someone say, "Saint Paul"?

    LOVE that show from '77 (AND the Saint Paul show from the 1978 box), but cannot allow myself to get distracted from my E72 studies. I still need to finish Bickershaw AND Amsterdam, then get to Rotterdam on its anniversary today. The back-to-back concerts on this tour make things difficult . . .

    I didn't get into Grateful Dead until I was 21 (1991), but if I had been born ten or fifteen years earlier, I would have attended those old MN and upper-midwest shows.

  • #1428
    Cousins Of The…
    Joined:
    @Dennis

    Hey Dennis, I'll take your Hummingbird if it's lonely :-)
    I play guitar in a band(Western Swing/Honky Tonk) , although not sure when we'll be able to play out again this year.

  • #1429
    Dennis
    Joined:
    Dave's guitar and Dave's Pick

    Just got DP29 in from Real Gone Music. I never bought any of the DP's when they were coming out, my buddy was getting them and sending me copies, money was tight and what the hell. In the end, wish I had bought them all as they came. Now I'm too cheap to pay some of the prices I see for complete sets, and the wife would never understand :-).

    I have to say for anyone who hasn't bought these real gone music releases, they did a nice job on it. At first blush I thought the bonus tracks weren't included, but though not listed, they are there. It was 60 bucks from amazon (got a price cut before it shipped!) So maybe I'll look into getting the real gone collection,,,,, if it's cheap enough :-)

    Dave the Rock and the Gretsch - I know Dave's not the only one on these boards who has guitars AND I know absolutely NOTHING about guitars or playing. But I looked up your guitar and yeah, pricey things. The demo's online made it sound very nice. My question, can you really play? I've met many people over the years who have instruments of all types, played "in my youth", they can still strum a few basic cords, but really can't play. I have a Gibson hummingbird my wife gave me back in 83-ish, why, I have no idea. Maybe she thought I develop unknown talents. I told it's a nice guitar, quite a few people have strummed it over they years and say "very nice". But one night at the store a customer who came in all the time (doctor of some sort), had just bought a new hummingbird, asked me bring in my old one. Bastard sat down and knocked out UJB off top of head. Blew me away. BTW - said my old hummingbird was much louder than new ones.

    So Dave, do you play? Also other folks out there, do you really play? I believe some of you are in bands?

    Just curious.

  • #1430
    musicnow
    Joined:
    bonus disc

    The bonus disc is simply amazing! Classic songs/jams and the sound is superb. This was a GRATE addition to a magnificent show. Thank you Dave!

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Submitted by clayv on
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"To my ears, the best Dead shows are those that not only fit the criteria that make them amongst the best of a year, but that are also completely unique for their era—shows that fit perfectly into their year of performance, but also fall somewhat outside of the norm for that year. Harpur College, Veneta, Cornell, Cape Cod, and Augusta are all shows that are objectively excellent, and if they are not the best from their respective years of performance, they are certainly unique. Miami 6/23/74 falls into that category: not only one of the very best shows from this outstanding year, but also one of the most interesting and unique. It’s certainly worthy of many, many deep listens." - David Lemieux

¡Ándale, ándale! ¡Arriba, arriba! We're back with a hot one from Miami, F-L-A. DAVE’S PICKS VOLUME 34 features the complete show from the Jai Alai Fronton, 6/23/74, one with unparalleled sound quality due in equal parts to the Wall Of Sound and the beautiful sonic clarity of Kidd Candelario's tapes. The first set is chock full of dynamite takes on classics like "Ramble On Rose," "Mississippi Half-Step," and "Cumberland Blues." The second set delivers on the JAMS - one leading into a gorgeous "Ship Of Fools," one rare instrumental version of "Dark Star," and a "Spanish Jam," this is Miami after all! The show also offers up a "first" and an "only" - the former, a Seastones set featuring Phil and Ned Lagin and the latter, the sole Grateful Dead performance of Chuck Berry's "Let It Rock."

Limited to 22,000 numbered copies, DAVE’S PICKS VOL.34: JAI ALAI FRONTON, MIAMI, FL 6/23/74 has been mastered from the 7.5 IPS reel-to-reel tapes to HDCD specs by Jeffrey Norman. ¡Agarrarlo mientras esta calientito! (Get it while it's hot!)

*Limited to 2 per order. Very limited quantity available.

Subscribed to Dave's Picks? With this release, you'll also get a bonus disc with selections from Miami 6/22/74. Excellente!

Yes, I am fine thanks - hope you are too. The clip you posted pushed me back to Elmore James and then on to Robert Johnson. Which inspired me to dust off my own open tuned geetar and play a bit of slide myself. I have always thought Sunday was a good day for the blues. Though Monday isn't bad and Tuesday is also cool.

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Submitted by Charlie3 on Sun, 05/17/2020 - 12:34

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...an image or two of her did cross my mind when WKRP came up.

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9 years 1 month

Submitted by Charlie3 on Sun, 05/17/2020 - 15:55

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Willie Nelson's Stardust album, cool stuff.

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15 years 2 months

Submitted by Seth Hollander on Sun, 05/17/2020 - 18:49

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Read this in a post on the Steve Hoffman Forums the-grateful-thread.349350/page-4293.
no one on the thread, a community of frequent commenters like here, have mentioned this post at all since (as of 5/17, the thread is on page 4331). That seems to imply that this problem is not one many people are having.
But I checked mine, and I do have it! I am not a member there, but there are members there who read these threads, so posting here still amplifies his signal, and it spreads word to here....

"…wanted to let everyone know that I have noticed even more deterioration in the CDs from the first year of Dave’s Picks (volumes 1-4). That guy who gave me a hard time about this has been banned so I feel free to bring it up…

Now I have the following problems:
- volume 1 disc 1 only plays with static
- volume 1 disc 2 plays but has visible deterioration or peeling of the edges of the reflective layer
- volume 2 discs 1 and 2 do not play at all
- volume 2 disc 3 only plays with static
- volume 4 discs 1 does not play at all
- volume 4 disc 2 only plays with static

All of these discs worked perfectly after I bought these sets (new, as a subscriber, although volume 4 is an unnumbered replacement sent when my subscription copy never arrived.) I played volume 3 six or so months ago and it was fine but shall check again this evening. I’ll check the 2012 bonus disc as well."

When I checked my 2012 Dave's sets:
on my Volume 1 my disc 1 is like his, and my discs 2 & 3 are like his disc 2.
In my Vol 4 all 3 discs play with static.
My volumes 2 and 3 look and play fine, although I didn't play more than the first 15 seconds of each disc.

So, people, time to listen to those 2012 Dave's. I hope you'all have good ones!

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Submitted by wilfredtjones on Sun, 05/17/2020 - 20:29

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I too am experiencing this. Noticed it with my DaP 2 - Scarlet Begonias will not play. Thankfully I have everything ripped to FLAC and Mp3. But, it particularly sucks. Goes to show, Nothing Lasts!

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10 years 9 months

Submitted by seahorseforce119 on Sun, 05/17/2020 - 21:44

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1974 Grateful Dead is
As if origami were music
so intricate and beautiful.
awwhewh all the layyyerrrs and dimensions, wshshshsh
gotta love this stuff

I have played the first 7 Dave's Picks this year, and didn't notice anything wrong. A bit worrying though. Nothing lasts...but going off vinyl I bought in the 70s and cds in the 90s...it used to last a bit longer than this. 2012 is like yesterday to me.

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Submitted by Lovemygirl on Mon, 05/18/2020 - 03:00

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... Hello, wishing everyone a grateful day today!
I have experienced the same issues with my Dave’s picks as well with older releases including Dicks Picks, Roadtrips, etc and Boxsets as well. It’s a quality issue that concerns me as well. Nothen last for ever,(that’s my two cents lol) I understand that , but I have CDs from Columbia house ha ha , that work just fine.
Sometimes it’s not the cd itself, but what your playback someone uses. Because Technology can be a problem Technology can be a problem For example getting older disks to play on new equipment or vice versa if you get what I’m trying to say... since then I’ve tried & done many experiments on fixing the problem.
I’m not going to write it all, it’s much to long for a single post but I will give you the most effective and best TIP to playback those giving their owners problems.
Now it might sound funny, weird even foolish but this is the way I had the most successful playback results with the CDs that I had trouble with.
Now this only applies to Nonstationary CD players.
#1 after putting the CD in the player & while your “CD Player/ playback loads and begins decoding info on the disk, PUT your “CD player” on An 45° angle with the front/face of the playback machine facing you to the highest degree. it allows the ‘Laser’ to identify/read the information on the disk/CDs.
So much better . It’s all technical gibberish that I’m not gonna get into here because it’s a lot of data to write ;share. I can send messages or an email if need be.but give it a try give it a go. If your first attempt does not work try again you can also change that 45° angle to a different degree so as your playback is reading your CV you can move the CD player either up or down to raise or did the crease in the grease for the laser to scan more effectively.
I apologize for the poor writing skills and grammar it’s not my forte I’m an artist lol.
Well I hope this post will help some of those people having playback issues.
Have a grateful day everyone, peace be with you all! 🙏❤️💀🌹

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Submitted by direwulf on Mon, 05/18/2020 - 03:19

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I keep my collection in a wood cabinet with humidity control, checked my first year copies and no playing or static issues to confirm. However, the foil on Dave's Vol. 1 is peeling for sure on discs 1 and 2. The peeling is only slight pieces on the very edge of the cd and it still plays fine. But I will not be putting it into a CD player that pulls a disc in, stopped that year ago. It may be that's what the damage is from, hopefully it is not from environmental degradation of the physical foil. That would be crushing, still one of my favorite Dave's and it sounds amazing. Not to mention replacement discs are long gone and the CD sets are $350+ on resale, and if the problem is with manufacturing you could spend $600 on a sealed copy and the discs are nonfunctional.

Its a distressing concern for sure, especially considering how much this stuff costs. You'd think they could shell out the extra cents for the foil that's attached with quality. I have CDs from decades ago that came out of gloveboxes and look in better shape than some of the flimsy Dead releases. Interesting how some years the discs look thick and quality with good printing and then others they are flimsy CDs with poor looking quality backings. As time goes by a complete set of releases may become extremely valuable if people's collections continue to deteriorate just sitting on a shelf.

Question is try and stop the peeling with some sort of permanent glue or adhesive and risk it ruining the disc completely or leaving it to mother nature and hope the disc doesn't degrade further? Now I know how the curator and preservationist at Louvre feels.

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Submitted by direwulf on Mon, 05/18/2020 - 03:31

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I DO NOT recommend that any one starts doing this with their CD player or discs to get them to work. This highly "technical" process of leaning will most likely further damage your discs, the CD player, and your self-esteem for trying this ridiculous Fonzi-style method of electronic manipulation.

I was out at dinner once years ago with close friends and the "new guy" from work that invited himself along. After we all got our beers, he asked for a sip of mine to try before he ordered. I obliged being a gentleman and all. Once he finished and returned the glass to me he proclaims, "Oh!!!....my bad let me get that." And before I knew what he was talking about, the guy grabbed my beer and LICKED (yes) from the base of the glass to the rim to catch a drop of beer running down the side. He then promptly handed me the glass with a shit eating smile, looking like "Hey, no problem. You're welcome!" The advice about holding your CD player at odd angles made me think of this guy. Don't be that guy.

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Submitted by Roguedeadguy on Mon, 05/18/2020 - 03:33

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I need some new ones.

What does everyone use? Any recommendations ? Music appreciation being the dominant factor in my decision, of course.

I'm not opposed to spending some cheese for quality ones, up to a point. I'll know that point when I see it.

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8 years 3 months

Submitted by Roguedeadguy on Mon, 05/18/2020 - 03:44

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Now is an excellent time to rip them and back them up. Even if you still prefer to play the physical CD vs digital, at least you won't lose the music.

Well I'm by no means an audiophile but i just picked up these headphones
https://www.crutchfield.com/p_158MDR1AM2/Sony-MDR-1AM2.html

I got them to go with my Sony DMP and they sound great...I prefer over the ear cups and I don't require Bluetooth (I avoid it) so these seem to be doing the trick...my portable player by the way is a Sony NW-A45 Walkman that plays all files, FLAC, WAV, Hi Res 24 bit files etc....I have purchased a few Hi Res releases, mainly the Deluxe Live At Leeds by The Who and the Deluxe Brothers and Sisters by the Allman Brothers which has a complete '73 Winterland show...they both sound incredible...Music in the time of the plague is the way to go...good luck in the hunt...oh and thanks too for your post, when I looked up the headphones I saw they were on sale for $50 less then when I bought mine three weeks ago...time to call customer service!

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12 years

Submitted by Dennis on Mon, 05/18/2020 - 07:06

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first - Your right Dave the Rock, 2012 WAS just yesterday!

I could whine about how you all made me pull out my banker boxes of Dead disc to get out DaP 1 to check it, BUT, I haven't put them away yet from the last time I pulled them out a month ago. And the Dave Collection was on top:-)
I didn't see anything on the playing side of the disc, but I did see a little (LITTLE), piece of the label missing. The silver edge of the label, almost like they didn't shellac the label under. I can't imagine it will affect the play. Maybe some people having these issues, actually use the real disc and the life in a car maybe too much for them.

I agree that some players can have trouble playing some disc, sometimes a software update will do you, my Blu-ray player needed an update once to play some movie.

Furthur agree damn things should last a lifetime. They used to say cassettes were only good for so long, I think the trouble there were "store bought" cassette, I think the tape was thinner and very easy to have stretch or snap. But my Maxwells that I made in 1980 still play AND they were carried around in the car. And we know, short of fire, vinyl IS forever! Hell a paper cone with a pin shoved thru it will play a LP. My collection of 78's are from the 40's, still play. Though can be hard to find a turntable that plays 78's and in my case a turntable to play anything!

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Submitted by Dennis on Mon, 05/18/2020 - 07:11

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quick thought, I could be wrong for sure. I wouldn't use anything blue tooth for audio (but I do sometimes), in any event I believe Bluetooth compresses the data. So if you're a big "audio" head who hates mp3's, don't play your flac/alac/wav via blue tooth, you will be losing data.

I think that's true anyway.

Exactly correct about the Bluetooth connection not playing at quality levels...when I was looking at both player and headphones that seemed to be the general consensus on all the reviews I read, especially on the Hi Res files...also I think you're spot on regarding cassettes, I had a shoe box of FM recordings I had done in the 80's and I sent them to a friend who is an expert at digitizing cassettes and they sound fabulous for a nearly 40 year old tape source...

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Submitted by Dennis on Mon, 05/18/2020 - 07:28

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….. but, I assume everyone seen Neil Young has a "new" album coming out in June(?), Homegrown. Was suppose to be released after Harvest, but Neil was too bummed out apparently. It's been ordered,,,, along with Dylan's new album and Zappa's new collection from 1970. Don't tell the wife, I'm keeping it on the DL. I trying a new trick, I used her credit card to buy, this was she'll think she spent the money! I'll tell ya, my brain is so fuckin' big, it hurts.

Hey Nappy, you ever dive into the audio books?

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Submitted by unkle sam on Mon, 05/18/2020 - 08:32

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here in the mountains today, and tuesday's just as bad. Always loved that tune, was listening to the triple lp Isle of Wight from 1970 yesterday and the Stormy Monday came up, by Mountain, very cool version.. Love me some Leslie West. That entire lp is great, with some awesome artists on it, Hendrix, Ten Years After, Mountain, Cactus, Miles Davis, Procol Harum, Sly and the Family stone and Kris Kristofferson, good stuff. There were so many bands playing at this festival, the first great rock festival of the seventies. There was a dvd released also of most of the performances. Hell of a bill, with the above acts plus Jethro Tull, The Doors, Chicago, The Who, Emerson, Lake and Palmer, The Moody Blues, Free, Taste (Rory Gallagher) and more. Spirit was scheduled to play but did not play. Would have loved to have been at that one, any of our English brethren been to the Isle of Wight?

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Submitted by JimInMD on Mon, 05/18/2020 - 08:47

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I have a pair of audiophile wired headphones.. they sound terrific, and I never use them. I have settled into a lossless wireless pair that sound good and give me the mobility I need.

https://en-us.sennheiser.com/wireless-headphones-home-audio-rs-175

They are not Bluetooth.. they send and receive a lossless signal. Never really shopped around, I'm sure there's better pairs out there.. but they work for me. There seem to be pros and cons of every aspect.. finding a good pair of headphones is kind of like finding a comfy pair of shoes.

Good luck, whatever you decide.

ROGUEDEADGUY: I rarely post on here, but saw your comment on recommendations for quality headphones, so I thought I'd share since I just purchased these a few weeks back. They are truly amazing headphones for the price.

https://www.audeze.com/products/lcd-1

They are lightweight, but durable that sound amazingly rich and full. I can't get Dave's 34 out of CD player since I bought these.

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Submitted by nappyrags on Mon, 05/18/2020 - 11:16

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Yes I did Sir and mucho thanks... had a bit of a problem when iTunes went kablooey on me...I’m slowly rebuilding my library for my classic iPod for spoken word only...I am using my Sony DMP for music...my CD player in my car just stopped working so now I’ll be looking for a new one I guess... I’m about to jump back into Lord of the Rings as read by Rob Ingliss

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Submitted by daverock on Mon, 05/18/2020 - 11:21

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Talk about lasting power...this Little Richard box I ordered, and have just about plucked up courage to touch, was made in 1989. Nearly as old as the original recordings were when the box came out. The first two cds sound incredible-almost like he's returned from the dead and popped into my living room for a hoot n' a holler.

Sam..Isle of Wight was just before my time, unfortunately.

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Submitted by Deadheadbrewer on Mon, 05/18/2020 - 12:00

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Maybe it's a pianist thing (I've played most of my life), but when I started the '72 Lille show the other day for the first time, I said to myself, "Self--Keith's pee-yan-er there sounds a might bit diff'rent today . . . " Then I read the liner notes that mention that they couldn't get a Steinway like Keith had had for all the other E72 shows, and that at Lille he played a Bluther. On classical recordings I've often admired the Bluther sound.

Headphones--as we know, wired, open-back are generally best for sound purposes, and I sure love my Grado 325i's. I have a pair of closed-back Ultrasone HFi-780s that I enjoy. Those are going cheap on eBay because there is a new model out.

Used Columbia House and BMG to build an enormous cassette, then CD collection at little cost. In middle school I signed up something like fourteen classmates one year, mostly by offering them one of the four free cassettes that I received for signing them up. My dad eventually got suspicious and asked me just how I was paying for all this music that kept arriving. When I told him how I was hitting up everyone I saw, then offering them a better deal than if they signed up through someone else, he was proud. Our clan is a long line of salespeople.

The CD player thing sounds more like a dirty or dying laser assembly than faulty discs. Try opening the player and cleaning the lens, but plan on a new player. Just had a CD player fail, and it wouldn't play some discs at the end, ESPECIALLY the more recent discs from Dead.net. When it would play some of them, there was the static-y sound you mention.

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Submitted by simonrob on Mon, 05/18/2020 - 13:46

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I went to the Isle of Wight Festival in 1970, but only for the Saturday. At the time I was living in Portsmouth, just a ferry and a bus ride away. 50 years ago so my memories are vague. I do remember not enjoying the Doors. I'm pretty sure there was not a word uttered from the stage between numbers. The Who played most, if not all of Tommy. I was sat up on Desolation Hill with a good, if distant view of the stage.

But you probably had already guessed that I was there.

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Submitted by Dennis on Mon, 05/18/2020 - 14:02

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I've been working my way though a new chunk of Star Wars.

I think the next trilogy in the movies will be Grand Admiral Thawn.
(you heard it here first)

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Submitted by daverock on Mon, 05/18/2020 - 14:48

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Simon - did you go in that tent where Hawkwind and the Pink Fairies played ? For some people, that has become more legendary than the main event. Apart from the Hendrix set, of course.

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Submitted by wilfredtjones on Mon, 05/18/2020 - 16:26

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I am going to go through my other 2012 discs just in case. But, I was noticing it with just that one track when I happened to pull out the physical discs lately (which I don't normally do).

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Submitted by simonrob on Tue, 05/19/2020 - 01:02

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No I didn't find that tent where Hawkwind and the Pink Fairies were playing. I also didn't stay for the Sunday so I didn't see Hendrix either. I wasn't really in a festival mood that weekend and seeing the Doors didn't help.

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Submitted by wilfredtjones on Tue, 05/19/2020 - 04:55

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DaP 1 - Mississippi Half-Step has static. Continuing with my experiment and will report results. This is coming from a person that has ripped to digital and stored their physical discs faithfully.

Check your discs.

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Submitted by wilfredtjones on Tue, 05/19/2020 - 05:43

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Promised Land Track 11 playing right now with static.

Check your discs!

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Submitted by billy the kid on Tue, 05/19/2020 - 06:58

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I just played Mississippi Half Step and it sounds like shit. Wow, these cds really degraded fast. I've only played this once or twice since I first got it, I have cds that I've played over the years hundreds of times and they are still fine. I wonder if the cds are still being manufactured like this. Makes me not want to purchase anymore.

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Submitted by Vguy72 on Tue, 05/19/2020 - 07:16

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....and now deteriorating Dave's? 2020 SUCKS!!
edit. I played disc one of Dave's 1 this weekend and it sounded fine. I also played Sgt. Peppers, which was one of the first CD's i ever bought back in 1987 and it plays fine as well.

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Submitted by billy the kid on Tue, 05/19/2020 - 07:37

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I definitely won't be buying anymore Dave's Picks subscriptions if this is going to be the fate of my cds. I'm not pissed about this, I've had much worse things happen to me in my life,as has everybody else on this forum. I'm happy for the people who have ripped their cds, I don't. From now on I will only buy alacarte the years that I' m most interested in 1967 to 1971, or shows that I personally attended, at least I can enjoy them for a few years before they degrade. Dave seems like a really nice guy and hopefully he will come on here and address this issue.

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Submitted by simonrob on Tue, 05/19/2020 - 07:45

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Don't hold your breath waiting for that. Rhino don't have a good track record when it comes to addressing problems. We can always remain optimistic and hope things change, but I don't think the odds are that good.

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Submitted by Seth Hollander on Tue, 05/19/2020 - 07:45

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In my first post, I said my Da2 and Da3 seemed fine. Thatw as based on playing the first 15 seconds of each disc.
When I tried saving my disc two of DaP1 (disc appeared damaged but played the first 15 seconds fine), I discoverd the "static" issue was on the disc, starting late in Estimated and overwhelming the second half of Terrapin. After the trouble my computer had opening the Terrapin track, I didn't even try Drums.
Decided I better give complete listens to Da2 and 3. Got through disc one of Da2 last night. Played fine until the last track. That song was ravaged with bursts of static. Definitely gonna save both Da2 and 3 to HD ASAP, regardless of static status...

Takeaway: When investigating disc condition, play the last track on the disc, not the first!

edit: " disc one of Da2" really was disc one of Da3. Da3 is my fave of the first four, and by far the most important one to keep playable for me...

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Submitted by mpace on Tue, 05/19/2020 - 07:59

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First it was false advertising (72 box), then physical damage and bad discs (1990 and 73 box), and now poor quality is causing disc rot. That's it for me. I'm glad that I did not invest in the 30 trips around the sun. I'm sorry for those that did because of the potential of all dead.net discs having faults with deterioration. What a terrible business.

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Submitted by CaseyJanes on Tue, 05/19/2020 - 08:07

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Happy to help with clean digital copies of damaged discs if anyone wants them. PM me if you do.

KCJ

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Submitted by wilfredtjones on Tue, 05/19/2020 - 08:30

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Disc 2 ok. On Disc 3 Other One right now, sounds ok. Fingers crossed. Like I said before, the opening Scarlet from my DaP 2 was faulty. But, that's on deck and DaP 3 is in the hole (Baseball reference).

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Submitted by JeffSmith on Tue, 05/19/2020 - 08:47

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I just listened to the first tracks on my Dave's 1, CD1 for the first time since I ripped 'em and, knocking on wood, all was well. Then, after reading Seth's post, I cued up Dave's 2, CD2. I've finished the amazing Estimated and am just about through a laid-back, smooth as silk He's Gone (not Terrapin). The gods must have smiled – no static. I'm still worried though about all my other releases and, of course, for anybody with noise or worse. Yeah, weirder shit has/is happening, but I always count on GD music as a reliable shelter from the storm. Hope it doesn't fade away. . .

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Submitted by billy the kid on Tue, 05/19/2020 - 09:18

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Dave s Picks 2 & 4 won't play at all, Dave s #3 extreme static, unlistenable , Dave s #1 , track 1 sounds like you are hearing it played underwater, it plays after that but has static and way to much bass. Maybe it's your CD player. Nope, Dave s 17 & 22 play fine. Oh well, easy come, easy go. I won't spend anymore money here.

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Submitted by Dennis on Tue, 05/19/2020 - 09:46

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I've only test Dap 1, first and last track, both fine.

Big problem though, huh. How the hell can you go back and check every fucking disc. How many disc would that even be? And it's not like it's always song 1, no maybe jimmybob's disc 1 song 5 if screwed, but Maryjo's disc 1 song 2 has got the rot!. Easy to blame on Rhino, but it's prevalent though out any thing corporate, if you can save a penny on a 10 dollar item....

I think you got about as much chance as a fart in a windstorm in getting these disc replaced! Not like they come with a lifetime guarantee! I doubt they come with a week's worth of that. I rip all to mp3 when they arrive. Easy to save make wave copy of every disc you buy, but then you're counting on replacement disc lasting forever or you're ripping to a HD AND hoping HD will never go bad! I can't be the only one with bad HD's in their past, right? Double backups go a long way to protecting your shit, but boy, what a sweat in the ass that would be. You kinda count on a cd being "The Hardcopy Backup". Hate to think about an EMP blast, entire digital collections wiped out! OMG!!

In the meantime I'll keep on storing my disc in a climate control environment and pray to the Flying Spaghetti Monster that all will be right.

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Submitted by JimInMD on Tue, 05/19/2020 - 09:54

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..but They could replace just the discs and not the packaging without breaking the bank.

They could even finance it with a special ala cart release like Nightfall of Diamonds. Think of the goodwill that would produce, and in the end it's the right thing to do.

Three comments:
- They could replace just the discs.
- How much was saved by switching to whatever production decision was made to get lesser quality blanks.
- I suspect this was outsourced and the decision to go cheap was made by whoever they outsourced it to.

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Submitted by unkle sam on Tue, 05/19/2020 - 10:01

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This is hard to swallow, what can be done about this? I have every one of these Dave's discs and have never opened them, now what, will they play? will they rot? will the sun shine on my back door someday? I have purchased every box set since the europe 72 box and I think I will put them all up on ebay now. what to do about these Dave's? I think I too have bought my last Dave's subscription, what a shame I do love the Grateful Dead so. Funny, I have disc's I purchased in the early 90's that still look and play great, why have these gone bad in just 8 years? Sounds like an investigation is warranted, can we all get a refund for these discs? can anyone who works here or at rhino check on that for us please. Hey Dave, will you address this, they have your name on them, if I was in this position, I would demand an investigation as to why the greatest music ever made has been put on inferior media. Wow, this is real bad for Rhino and Dead net.
I was right all along, Rhino is a lousy music company. I am done with Rhino. Greed rules again. I guess the only way to keep getting new Dead music is to get a copy from a friend, rip it right away and give it back, that way you get the great music we all love and don't get ripped off in the process. It just doesn't make since, spend all that time to remaster all these releases and then put them on subpar media, who's stupid idea was that? some suit who works at rhino and can only see $ signs? I guess we can all just buy vinyl, or has Rhino put all of that music on faulty media too? Who knows, we might never know but one thing is for sure, Rhino and Dead net just lost a buttload of trust and probably more than one customer. First Trump, then Corona, now Grateful Dead music on shitty discs, the world is truly coming to an end. Oh wait that caveat emptor thing might cover their asses on Dicks picks, is that same caveat emptor on Dave's as well? Don't recall seeing that on any of those.

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Submitted by Charlie3 on Tue, 05/19/2020 - 10:29

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...I think of myself as pretty cynical but I'm not seeing the reported disc degradation as evidence of some deadnet/Rhino plot to scam us out of our money for an inferior product. Is it possible some of these discs were stored in poor conditions? Is it possible that even a reliable manufacturer has unforeseen problems leading to failure of the product 8 years later? Is it possible deadnet/Rhino did not just find the cheapest fly-by-night outfit they could find to manufacture these discs? Do they deserve any benefit of the doubt? If I'm ever on trial accused of a crime, I hope you guys aren't on the jury.

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