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    marye
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    Bolo24 says: An Idea, Perhaps? Since we're all going to have a fair amount of spare time on our hands for the foreseeable future, what about starting another thread where we all listen to the same show/release on a given day and then share impressions afterward? Folks can submit suggestions and one person (not me) picks what we'll all listen to - call it Deadnet Picks or something. Anyway, if this idea is deemed to have merit, I'd suggest one of the loyal regular posters take the lead and do the picking - y'all can decide who. Might be fun. If it does go forward, I nominate Dick's Picks 18 for the first listen. Been talked about here lately, and, had it been a single show rather than a compilation, we'd probably be talking about it in the same conversation as Cornell, Veneta, etc. Or perhaps even Gainesville?? Stay safe and healthy, friends - this planet needs as many Deadheads as possible.

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  • Oroborous
    Joined:
    Speaking of…

    …I heard a rumor that that psycho loser Bobert kept saying “Hendrixfreak, Hendrixfreak, Hendrixfreak” at that Beatlejuice performance, and it was the final straw that got her booted!

    And I think maybe we lost Keithfan under there somewhere? Haven’t heard from him in fo ever…

  • JimInMD
    Joined:
    Re: HF

    HedrixFreak, HF, wherefore art thou?

    Hope he's alright.. we seem to occasionally lose people who (voluntarily) offer their services digging a tunnel under the vault to help free the reels. A hazardous occupation.

  • icecrmcnkd
    Joined:
    Sticking with the anniversary theme

    9-19-72%

    DaP 46 filler

    AKA, HF’s first show

  • JimInMD
    Joined:
    Dennis' Wife's Credit Card

    Hilarious.

    Let's just hope she doesn't read this stuff.

    Edit: I seem to have misplaced her PIN. Can someone PM me? I need the new Stax/Volt box set.

  • icecrmcnkd
    Joined:
    “Hey Rocky, watch me levitate Garcia”

    Per your suggestions, doing the 9-18-87 anniversary.

    I suspect that everything in the Vault that sounds good will get digitized, and a lot has probably been done already since the tapes are degrading and the job needs to get completed. Also, storing digital copies at various geographic locations can be an insurance policy against things like the Universal Music warehouse fire, California Earthquake(s), etc. Futhurmore, I assume that when Dave is perusing potential releases he listens to a digital copy, not a cassette copy, then he picks a few shows to discuss at the next business meeting.

    Some will get the Full Norman.
    Some will even get Plangentized.
    Everything that gets digitized will be available for download and/or streaming in the future, we may just not be alive to spend the money on such.
    The Vault will become the Catalog.
    We are financing the digitization of the Vault by buying the new releases.
    So bust out Dennis’ wife’s credit card and keep buying.
    (Well, at least Dennis can bust out the credit card)

  • Oroborous
    Joined:
    Misery loves company, JK

    Yeah 1stshow I hadn’t planned to do it.I mean I’ve been meaning to, but, like many things nowadays, always low on roundtoits ; ). Reminds me of this guy we picked up on Ziggy Marley tour doing merch back in 96 I believe.
    Flew into DC, met PK from Jersey, counted stuff in at the 9:30 club, then just tried to keep up with ole PK. Out on town all night, then immediately had to drive to next show etc…
    Dude knows everyone everywhere and can get you ANYTHING you need in almost any city!
    Damn Rastas were asking him to get them weed everywhere as he had better connections lol
    Been a road dog forever! Anywho, somewhere in the mayhem we ran into a buddy of his from Virginia who decided one show wasn’t enough fun. He only ment to go to the next one, and every night kept saying “ok, this is the last one, then I have to get back”…we’ll this went on for over a week until finally, after Panama beach show we literally had to make him get on a bus and go home lol. Guy was helpful and we all had big fun, but the poor bastard was wearing the same clothes etc and didn’t have anything with him, totally spontaneous trip. Think after a couple daze we bought him some fresh underwear and gave him a couple tour shirts to change into lol.
    So that’s kinda how I started E72 this time, ok, I’ll do one more. Finally, though this isn’t a good time, time wise etc, figured, fug it, buy the ticket, take the ride! So, always more fun with a tour buddy!

    Yeah, I’m with you on 5/3. It is a damn good show, but I didn’t get as blown away as some…
    But I’ll need to reacquaint with it…top five, good luck. I can’t do it. Their all so good, sure I like some perhaps more, but their just different enough I can’t pick a top dog…
    Yeah, what a surprise, the French were the most vocal lol

    Yeah DV, im worried about the VIKS, Bills too, though they seemed like their old selves again this week. But like the Viks, ya never know what’s next lol. Rootin for underdog Lions, and Falcons, though I really like this kid Field with Da Bears…
    I’ll have to try and find that Dave article. He always says that and he doesn’t do it all the time, and they have mostly stayed clear of anniversaries, but he has been dipping liberally from that early possibilities list he mentioned back at the start of DaP.

    Those all sound familiar Jim, but I’m on a job site so can’t look up in my Db.
    Tempting all, but I’m on tour in Europe with ole 1stshow and don’t like to listen to other Dead until the trip is over…
    1970 is perhaps last frontier I haven’t really got the toe wet yet. Need another roundtoit!

  • DeadVikes
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    Shows/Relix

    Hey OB, not off to a good start here in MN, but actually not that surprised. Go Bills!

    There is an interesting article in Relix with Dave L. that was posted last week I believe. Check it out.
    Dave claims there is no list and they don't generally release shows or box sets based on anniversaries. This year's box was just a coincidence. So, what does that mean for 2024? Not sure. Would love to see that October 74 Winterland box released. Who wouldn't?
    I thought the 74 Winterland shows were recorded by Bill Wolf as part of the Movie production agreement with United Artists. I believe everything is there and based on the material from the 2005 soundtrack, and bonus material, it is fantastic.

    Madison Square Garden 87. Those are some good shows Jim. Might have to join you on 9/18 as I have that 30 Trips show handy.

  • 1stshow70878
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    5-3-72 Paris

    Huge and another damn near perfect show with 3 Other Ones! The crowd seems more engaged and yelling a bit more than some of the more polite audiences. And interestingly they didn't understand that the show wasn't over at set break. Read attendee Bob Welle's review in DeadbaseX and his cool viewpoint of having been cruising around EU and just luckily caught this one, wondering who are these new people on stage.
    After all these good ones in a row it's hard to see the almost Barton Hall fervor over this one though. I'm having a tough time doing a top 5 of the first 11 shows they are all so good but this one is certainly in there. Onward indeedy! Didn't expect anyone to join in my insanity to do them all so good on ya' Oro. Had to do it once in a lifetime, lol.
    Cheers

  • JimInMD
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    Ha

    I was talking about a mini box of Feb '74 before they released 2/24 (and now 2/23), but I like the way you think.

    I always assumed, probably incorrectly, that there were problems with the recordings of much of the October 74 run. I know Owsley was very vocal that they had excessive bleeding from mic to mic, etc.

    As for something to listen to today.. not that I am strictly a Today in GD History person but 9/18/70, 9/18/74 and 9/18/87 were all excellent shows. 9/16/87 was surprisingly good for the period also.

    That's all I have for now.

  • Oroborous
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    Ok, back to Europe

    Hit 5/7, 5/10, and 5/11 this WE. Of course I’ve forgotten the finer points and things I wanted to say, but I’ve not wanted to be overly analytical, or get distracted with notes, and instead, just get right, relax, and try to enjoy them. (Which has not been hard ; )
    5/7 is just too much! It’s not always the most precise or perfect of the tour, but that’s because it’s a freight train on steroids!
    I’ve always preferred full steam ahead Dead even when that leads to more worts, not that this one has many, perhaps just a few more noticeable than some of the more reserved, precise (hey, they were trying to make an album) shows.
    Actually, I think the album factor is one reason this tour is so good. They’re in a place where they’re ontop of their game and can let it rip, but keeping it just enough under raps to keep the consistency high for recording purposes.
    Win win, but 5/7 seems more about the live gig, the large miserable crowd that seems to really appreciate the effort etc, more than playing it straight for the tape machine?
    Choo Choo, all aboard! what a beast! Garcia starts out in 5th gear and doesn’t let up for almost 4 hours!
    Dark Star AND an Other One! Full on grease fest with six beauties, including a nice LL that fits the format better than going on too long, and a nice unusual Segway into GDTRFB. Clearly they were enjoying themselves in spite of the conditions? They joke about blowing the big ones, but not this time bubba!
    I’ve had this one so have heard it several times, but it was a real treat to sit outside in a warm but not super hot day and just groove on this one!
    Yesterday I hit 5/10 for the first time and unfortunately didn’t get quite the best listen, at least to the later parts.
    But I did enjoy it, even if it was perhaps a little more laid back than 5/7 etc. Hey they all can’t be rocket ships lol.
    The word that kept coming to me was Smooth…this show seemed smooth. They’re gelling as a unit so well by now, and the consistency is so good. Sure there’s a miscue or clam every once in awhile, (I dare you to find a show that there isn’t ; ) but the overall tightness, energy, musicianship is truly better or on par with any tour they ever did!
    Of course there’s the sweet He’s Gone they finally got right, and why it’s the one! Another Sing me as they’ve worked that one in the repertoire nicely. And if I remember correctly, this had another of those unusual Other Ones, kinda jazzy perhaps and similar to 4/16? Unfortunately this one’s a blur for various reasons including hitting 5/11 afterwards. I’ll definitely want to rehit this, 5/3, and the Wembleys after the tour…but for now I want to go in order…
    Ok, 5/11, this one for whatever reason has always been perhaps my favorite?
    Not saying it’s the best show of the tour, just for whatever reasons perhaps my favorite?
    Certainly the set list is part of it: Nice Playing if not huge opener, plenty o grease, including a cool and final Caution, with final WHO Do You Love tease, Nice Truckin ender to mix it up, and a very cool, perhaps unusual Dark Star!
    Maybe it’s just because I think this might have been the first ala cart show I bought when I hand to the head realized what I was missing not having these Dark Stars? (Now realizing same about the cool spacey TOO’s)
    Other One can get real repetitive but these ones are often very diverse and different! The weirder the better I say!
    Whatever the reasons, this show, even after taking the tour plunge, still resonates very strong for me? Hey, I even think the cover art might be my fav? Ok, maybe I’ll hit it again streaming while working, before moving onto 5/13 and 5/16, both I’ve never heard yet, so hoping I’ll get to spend some extra time with em during the week…
    ONWARD! Ok, who stole my Heineken Dark?

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Bolo24 says: An Idea, Perhaps? Since we're all going to have a fair amount of spare time on our hands for the foreseeable future, what about starting another thread where we all listen to the same show/release on a given day and then share impressions afterward? Folks can submit suggestions and one person (not me) picks what we'll all listen to - call it Deadnet Picks or something. Anyway, if this idea is deemed to have merit, I'd suggest one of the loyal regular posters take the lead and do the picking - y'all can decide who. Might be fun. If it does go forward, I nominate Dick's Picks 18 for the first listen. Been talked about here lately, and, had it been a single show rather than a compilation, we'd probably be talking about it in the same conversation as Cornell, Veneta, etc. Or perhaps even Gainesville?? Stay safe and healthy, friends - this planet needs as many Deadheads as possible.
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In reply to by billy the kid

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I did listen to 12-31-77 a few days ago.
Might watch 12-31-78 for NYE.

Last 4,
all today because I just finished painting my kitchen.
11-7-85 miller.139852
12-21-68 miller.89718
7-25-74 miller.12656
3-23-95 miller.25273

All Miller’s.
Thanks Charlie.

Yes, 3-23-95 is quite nice.
The Bruce factor!

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Lets put it together tomorrow, and start on the 24th? So the 8 days of New Year' eve!! Bob t

How about instead.. a listing of shows where the Dead played at over 7.7k feet above sea level in elevation?

(in my best Rocky from Rocky and Bullwinkle, "that trick never works"). Ok. New Year's shows it is, I'm all in.

12/31 from 81 and 82 don't compare to the ones already suggested.. but they are no slouches and personal, under the radar favorites. I would also open up for suggestion that all the shows on the New Years run are up for grabs... if that's ok. Some of the shows just a couple days before were a ok with me and perhaps we would be remiss to ignore them. Besides, this keeps it a tad more interesting and less programmatic.

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Ok here goes... Just a first draft. Tried to get something from every era. Need one more for 8. Thoughts?? We can do this...

12/31/69 Boston Tea Party
12/31/71 Winterland
12/31/76 Winterland
12/31/78 Winterland
12/31/81 Oakland Auditorium
12/31/82 Oakland Auditorium
12/31/90 Oakland/Alameda County Coliseum

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In reply to by bob t

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And if you are looking for an aperitif, I listened to 12/30/69 this morning-tasty!

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Bob T great job, you are definitely the hub of the wheel.. Oh, forgot one, GOGDs pick, 12/31/72, starts out with a great version of Around & Around.

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Most definitely a different feeling with home town shows. 12/23/70 is well worth a listen. Most of the way through this morning. Jim is correct that with any given New Years run it was an excellent chance that an earlier date besides NYE could be higher quality. 12/29/77 and 12/30/77 qualify.
Happy birthday Jorma.

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I really like that 72 New Years Eve show with David Crosby!!! Also agree how good the shows that weren't on NYE like a 12/29/77 or 12/30/ 69 or even1/2/70 are. Bob t

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Another great show not on New Years Eve, 1/2/72.

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In reply to by bob t

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12/23/70 Digging that Deep Elem Blues!

Synchronicity in this selection Strider.
Not only did Jorma perform on this bill.
But there's a whole post at Lost Live Dead about how the Dead could even book this show 8 days before playing a Winterland NYE show :)
http://lostlivedead.blogspot.com/2012/03/december-23-1970-winterland-gr…

Good stuff.

NYE Show Extravaganza!
Looks like it's shaping up. Nice work Bob T.
And yeah, don't forget 1972!!
Also to rock the boat 1989 NYE worth trying to fit in there somewhere?

As for the shows that surround the NYE runs, we can discuss our favorites while we listen to these here NYEs.

The NYE hometown runs don't really start until '77 and two of the best surrounding run shows happened that year as mentioned here earlier by someone who saw them, Strider that's you. 12/30/78 is great too, but that's at the Pauley. Most of the '79 run is better than NYE. The list goes on, 12/28/83 is another. But we can talk about that ad nauseam while we listen to these here NYE shows. And maybe make a list of top 8 surrounding NYE shows and listen to those afterwards :)

How's that sound?

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I'm hip!

So what's that list looking like now?
Cause '72 might mess up the math.

Maybe swap '71 for '72?
Don't wanna mess with BTK's bro's first show... but if I recall correctly '72 is more spectacular and it's one of my fave NYEs.
Not to mention Bill Graham's favorite NYE moment happened that night.

Am I being difficult?
Freakin' Dead Heads!!

So are we thinking chronologically?
Start with 69 end with 90
Or start with 90 and end with 69.

What are your thoughts on that?
Or we could give each show a number 1-8 and use a random number generator to establish order.

Just thinking out loud here. But curious about that.
Once that's established we're ready to go on the NYE bender.

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....nice.
I vote for oldest to newest.

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... How about the the old 1999dead records release ‘’Mother McCree’s Uptown Jug Champions’ featuring Jerry Garcia, Bob Weir, Pigpen ‘Live At The Yop Of The Tangent, 1964
July 16,17&18th as a started for the new Year among us ever so closely! Full Circle!
🙏❤️🤠💀🌹

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... How about the the old 1999dead records release ‘’Mother McCree’s Uptown Jug Champions’ featuring Jerry Garcia, Bob Weir, Pigpen ‘Live At The Yop Of The Tangent, 1964
July 16,17&18th as a started for the new Year among us ever so closely! Full Circle! I have two copies, one open and the other is still sealed!
I would recommend any fan of the band should have this little key to return to a important historical point & time in the birth of the Grateful Dead !
🙏❤️🤠💀🌹

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Leeds us to the mother ship which contains a plethoras of primo performances recordings available to release for the first New Year announcement which should be creeping in here any minnow my fine feathered friends! Let’s run let’s run run run ! 🙏❤️🤠💀🌹

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And it's 8, 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1
Here we go!

It's on, a NYE party that spans 8 days.

12/31/69 Boston Tea Party - Thursday Xmas Eve
12/31/72 Winterland - Friday Xmas
12/31/76 Winterland - Saturday
12/31/78 Winterland - Sunday
12/31/81 Oakland Auditorium - Monday
12/31/82 Oakland Auditorium - Tuesday
12/31/89 Oakland/Alameda County Coliseum - Wednesday
12/31/90 Oakland/Alameda County Coliseum - Thursday NYE

Happy New Year!

Brought to you by BobT & the POTD crew.

Happy Holidays to everyone!

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Happy Xmas / War is Over! If you want it
“Another year over and a new one just begun”
John & Yoko

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What a great loss and a sweet, wonderful human being. Saw him and Felix many times back in the 70's, those were great shows, Leslie could really rock and what a great slide player, check out "Crossroader" from the Flowers of Evil lp, and from The road goes ever on lp, the live version from the aforementioned lp is hot. The entire live side of Flowers of Evil is also very good. Dream sequence>Dreams of Milk and Honey>Roll over Beethoven, soo gooood. Some of the loudest concerts too, and when it was all over, they were all drenched in sweat, especially Leslie.

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Mo Monitors! And the only NYE concert outside the Bay Area

Everything to be seen at the Tea Party on New Year's Eve was a direct descendant of the Acid Test. The wall behind the band was bursting with gaseous, exploding galaxies, vibrant suns, flickering dots and spastic paramecia; every facet of the curving walls was covered with projections of comic strips, nudes, old etchings, portraits of the marijuana weed and photos of Boston; two movie projectors showed sporadic clips of Looney Toons, Spencer Tracy's "Boy's Town," and Olivier's "Othello."  And, of course, the Dead were there.

- from the Boston Herald Traveler, 11 January 1970 by Timothy Crouse

Too Much!!

The Boston Tea Party sounds like a pretty hip place. Also of note, by the time of this show it was located in the same building that was formally known as The Ark, which the Dead famously played in April and yes we all want those shows released. From what I can tell it had a capacity of around 1900 people.

The recording we've got here by Bear didn't come into circulation until early 1998 and is pretty dang sweet!
It also includes possibly the weirdest ending to a NYE show ever. I mean who else but the GOGD would spend hours getting folks all raved up only to drop into 4 obscure acoustic numbers at the end of the night?!?!
There's gotta be a story there, I think I remember reading it, but can't recall the specifics.
(Phil teases Dark Star and then Jerry calls it off and says let's take a break:)

"Well, it looks like the 1970s are going to be weird." - Jerry Garcia

This is one of those shows, that falls in the... "Think that was good? Well you shoulda been here last night!" category.
That being said... last show of the 1960s who can resist?!?!
And first of the NYE Extravaganza 2020.

Enjoy!

PS - If anybody has the Taper's Compendium Addendum let's talk. I really want to read that!
PPS - This is a repost / earlier post got deleted? Good thing I started saving them! Or is it so bad that it got trashed :)

12/29 is a warm up for 12/30/69

Might wanna just skip ahead to 12/30 & 12/31

Or listen to them all... it's the holidays!

Dug 12/31/69 it's a real good time.

15 seconds, 10, 9, 8, 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1.. Happy New Year!

This is one of my favorite NYE shows.
Maybe cause I love 1972.
Or it could just be the Playing In The Band shreds.
Either way, great way to end one of, if not the, greatest year in GD history.

Also, this show contains one of Bill Graham's & Bob Weir's favorite Winterland Moments and a famously told story.

This is the NYE show where the guy climbed down through the ceiling tiles and hung on the wire and they canceled the show and Bill Graham talked him down.
It happens between Sing Me Back Home and Johnny B. Goode.
Most of the time the audio is cut out, but is included on the Recording of FM Broadcast on KSAN along with a fun Europe '72 promo commercial.

Worth seeking out if you're a historical geek like me.

Alright, well what can I say..
Merry Christmas!!!
Have fun with this one.
And Peace on Earth and Goodwill towards People!

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My brother was at this show and he told me about the guy climbing in from the roof of Winterland. The Dead were looking up at him as he was hanging up there. Bill Graham asked him if there was anything he would like to say and he said "I'm 007" .

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Just one second, please.
If you could just try to find your way back the way you came up there. Please.

How about that Truckin' > The Other One > Morning Dew?!?!

I don't think I'll ever get tired of hearing that.
Most epic NYE jam IMO.
We'll see if I change that opinion during the Extravaganza.
I know '76 is pretty epic too, but there's no 40 minute Other One Jam...

Wow.

Alright, couple more fun facts.
Eyewitness states that the famous Winterland Mirror Ball made it's first appearance on this evening during PITB.
The band was wearing their Nudie Suits, 2nd of 4 appearances?
12/15/72
12/31/72
02/19/73
03/19/73 (partial;)

And yes, BTK he could only tell us his number, 007.
What a weirdo! Wonder what happened to that guy...

And now can we hear it for the greatest rock n' roll band in the world.
The Grateful Dead, please.

Alright, Good Stuff.
Happy Christmas!

PS - Anybody have the Dead.net Bonus CD that came with Winterland '78?
Supposedly that Bill Graham exchange is on there as a hidden track.
LMK if you're out there, I'm sure I've got something cool to trade for a copy.

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I have the New Year's at Winterland Bonus with Bill G. I can rip it for you, provided it's not disc rotted like my DaP 1-4 and RT 4.5. I love those unexpected surprises. Be well, all. :-)

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That would be so awesome!!

LMK what I can do to help make that happen.

Thanks WTJ and Happy Christmas!

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Big Ole Hello to all you folks out there in radio land as well

ne plus ul·tra
/ˌnē ˌpləs ˈəltrə,ˌnā ˌpləs ˈəltrə,ˌnā ˌplo͝os ˈo͝oltrə/
noun
1. the perfect or most extreme example of its kind; the ultimate.

Great liner notes by David Lemieux and Glenn Lambert (who was one of the host DJs of the KSAN broadcast) for this one.

Dave uses the ne plus ultra phrase in reference to 1974 performances of Playing In The Band, I guess I’ve always felt that was 1972. Something about Jerry’s playing and the Alligator sound vs Jerry’s Wolf sound just rings my bell harder. Did I mention I love Playing In The Band from 1972?

Anyway, this might suggest a new avenue of exploration for me. 1974 Playing In The Band relisten mission. However, I digress... big time.

We’re not talking about 1972 or 1974 right now, we’re talking about 1976 and in particular 12/31/76.

Epic Set 1 closing Playing In The Band which has hints of the days of yore and yet is rooted in the present which at the time of this recording was the last moments of 1976.

Last GD cow palace show, and possibly one of the most consistently fine played NYE shows in the history of the Grateful Dead? After this they’ll play every NYE through 1991.

I wonder if Glenn has a recording of the whole KSAN broadcast? How about it Glenn?
(apparently not to be confused with Gary! do your research ;)

Speaking about wondering.
I’m wondering if anybody has that Spirit of ’76 Bonus CD that came with Pre-Order from Dead.net?
Couple unreleased nuggets on there I’d love to get a hold of. Get a hold of me if you do :)


Meanwhile enjoy another epic NYE show by the Grateful Dead with the Spirit of ’76.

And big shout out to wilfredtjones for being an awesome DeadHead.
Thanks man you rock!

PS - Why didn't that Here Comes Sunshine Jam happen at like every show or at least during every Good Lovin' without Pigpen? Love love love that!!!
So good.

A momentous occasion as we cruise into the 1980s here at Winterland in San Francisco.
1978 going on 1981, what you see before you is a 10, no wait 12, 12 foot long burning ember of marijuana.
Yes, let us begin the countdown…
- Dan Aykroyd Winterland 12/31/78

Brings a smile to my face, and really truly there is nothing like a Grateful Dead concert.

This tape was in some heavy rotation when I was but a teenage Dead freak. I mean just look at these Set lists, but it was more than that back then. It was the rumors, the stories, the legends, the guests, the recording, the performances. This tape held me spell bound just thinking about everything I was hearing and everything that was happening.

Let’s give it yet another go all these years later and see what happens, it’s already got me smiling.
Like a visit with an old friend.

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Roger that.
And back at you.
Happy Holidays!

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I remember when the tickets went on sale they were $30 dollars apiece, we were shocked, we were paying $7 dollars to go to shows at that time. The tickets were given out through a lottery, you sent in a S.A.S.E. with your check and you either got back your check or you received tickets, we got shutout and got back our checks. The day of the show tickets wrent on sale in the box office, my brother bought one, I could have had one, I decided to stay home and watch it on TV, I was with a bunch of friends and we had a blast.
..

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12/26/69 was wonderful yesterday. 12/31/69 two days ago was also super magical. I listened to 12/26/70 this morning. Will listen to 12/26/81& 12/27/81 later today.
Have listened to more Grateful Dead in 2020 than in years. Also read more books than in years. Finishing On Highway 61 by Dennis McNally. Fascinating history. Super well researched.
Peace out, no piece out.