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    clayv
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    Hear ye, hear ye, hear ye! Gentle mistresses and most distinguished gentlemen, we have come upon the release of the DAVE'S PICKS VOLUME 37, from the Fifteenth of April in the year Nineteen Seventy-Eight, at ye olde College Of William & Mary in Williamsburg, Virginia. Cast your waistcoats and your bonnets aside, the Grateful Dead are on steady gallop from the opening high-kick of "Mississippi Half-Step" into a where are we going? where have we been? "Passenger," followed by full-on versions of "Friend Of The Devil," "El Paso," "Brown-Eyed Women," and a double-barreled "Let It Grow>Deal." Catch your breath and straighten out your tricorne because the 2nd set shows no bounds with delightful takes ("Bertha>Good Lovin'," "One More Saturday Night") and introspection ("Candyman," "Playing In The Band"). Then - great fifes and drums - it's 15 minutes of "Rhythm Devils," with band and crew gathered round to amplify the merriment before delivering a rare incantation of "Not Fade Away>Morning Dew" that sets the soul alight. Pure jollification!

    The town crier's addendum:

    Three bags full! Lest you feel 4/15/78 beginneth and endeth too quickly, we've selected highlights from Civic Arena, Pittsburgh, PA, 4/18/78 to satisfy your fancy.

    Limited to 25,000 numbered copies, DAVE'S PICKS VOLUME 37: WILLIAMSBURG, VIRGINIA 4/15/78 was recorded by Betty Cantor-Jackson and has been mastered to HDCD specs by Jeffrey Norman. It is guaranteed to sell out - often within hours.

    *2 per order. Very limited quantity available.

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  • Dark-Star
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    Hey Thin

    I am going to back pedal here. Mary E and Dr Phil may not be on the customer support contact list, but most who post regularly know who they are. And she appears to monitor the boards for issues and jumps in and posts for us to send her a PM sometimes. If you don't know who she is, all you have to do is ask on here how to work through an issue and someone like JimInMD or Icecrmcnkd say "PM marye". That's what I did and gave her my customer support ticket number. I've had plenty of minor issues that the phone and email people have resolved too.

    My main point is the only way the people picking up the phones are going to handle greater responsibility is if they're replaced by higher paid employees that have management skills, not worker bee skills. A move like that probably comes at the cost of higher priced products. Maybe no more early bird specials or maybe other CDs go up 5 bucks to pay for higher caliber people. I'm just saying for what probably amounts to less than half a percent of DaP sales, I would rather be patient and work with the system that is in place and has been working for years. I am not even saying don't post your issue. I am saying it is needless to criticize them harshly and to round up a cyber mob to try to solve a problem that can be be worked out with simple pleasantries. Especially when you consider that we are a small community and the same Mary E and Dr Rhino have been helping us for as long as we have all been coming here. They seem to me to be good people who care. But most important they resolve issues. No more "box cutter" issues, no loose slip covers or scratchy CD sleeves, etc. I will also say that with all of the online ordering this pandemic has caused me to do for all shopping needs, the service here is as reliable as any and better than most.

  • daverock
    Joined:
    Live....Dead

    I cant imagine going to any live gigs in London this year-as has been my habit for the past 20 years or so. Several bands have re-scheduled for later in the year, Live Dead 69 among them. But all the bands I see play in crowded venues-I have to get the train to get there-stay over night - it all seems a bit unlikely.

    I can see my self going to the odd gig here in Lowestoft, where I live. They practise social distancing here as a matter of everyday life-and always have.

    I enjoyed my one night in Las Vegas, about 30 years ago. We didn't gamble, just wandered around looking at what was going on - all that amazing neon. I remember seeing a young Elvis Presley impersonator perform in a club. Funny old night, actually.

  • icecrmcnkd
    Joined:
    Happy bday Phil

    3-15-90 observances

  • Vguy72
    Joined:
    Nope. Wasn't me....

    ....stuck at work. Would rather be in Flagstaff tbh. But that white SUV driver has impeccable taste. "I would like to meet him and shake his hand" - Red.

  • nappyrags
    Joined:
    Hey VGuy!!!!

    I had to go into Flagstaff today..was that you in a white SUV???...it had both a GD sticker and a Golden Knights sticker...just wonderin'....

  • icecrmcnkd
    Joined:
    Detroit land yachts

    Not too good on gas but they sleep 4-6 people.

  • icecrmcnkd
    Joined:
    reCRAPTCHA

    I think the crosswalk photo I just got was the RR tracks between the San Diego Convention Center and the Hard Rock Hotel.

  • icecrmcnkd
    Joined:
    Proudfoot, X Files last night

    I happened to watch the Simpsons X Files episode from the 90’s last night.

    Coincidence.......?

  • wilfredtjones
    Joined:
    Wait

    Am I supposed to hold the guitar in closer when I'm singing HAD? Please pardon any confusion.

  • nitecat
    Joined:
    Happy Birthday, Phil

    This amazing video may have already been posted, but here it is...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxiGvmtkkhs&t=4s

    The Terrapin Family Band & Friends wished Phil Lesh a happy birthday with a video of his Grateful Dead classic “Unbroken Chain.” The video features The Terrapin Family Band — Grahame Lesh, Ross James, Alex Koford, Jason Crosby, Nathan Graham and Elliott Peck — as well as Mike Gordon, Warren Haynes, Joe Russo, John Scofield and more.

    The amazing video also sees contributions from Jeff Chimenti, Adam MacDougall, Stanley Jordan, Larry Campbell and Teresa Williams, Amy Helm, Nicki Bluhm, Karl Denson, Holly Bowling, Eric Krasno, Anders Osborne, Jackie Greene, Tom Hamilton, Luther Dickinson, Jon Graboff, Scott Law and Dan “Lebo” Lebowitz. Phil’s son Grahame edited the video with audio mixing from TFB’s Ross James.

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Hear ye, hear ye, hear ye! Gentle mistresses and most distinguished gentlemen, we have come upon the release of the DAVE'S PICKS VOLUME 37, from the Fifteenth of April in the year Nineteen Seventy-Eight, at ye olde College Of William & Mary in Williamsburg, Virginia. Cast your waistcoats and your bonnets aside, the Grateful Dead are on steady gallop from the opening high-kick of "Mississippi Half-Step" into a where are we going? where have we been? "Passenger," followed by full-on versions of "Friend Of The Devil," "El Paso," "Brown-Eyed Women," and a double-barreled "Let It Grow>Deal." Catch your breath and straighten out your tricorne because the 2nd set shows no bounds with delightful takes ("Bertha>Good Lovin'," "One More Saturday Night") and introspection ("Candyman," "Playing In The Band"). Then - great fifes and drums - it's 15 minutes of "Rhythm Devils," with band and crew gathered round to amplify the merriment before delivering a rare incantation of "Not Fade Away>Morning Dew" that sets the soul alight. Pure jollification!

The town crier's addendum:

Three bags full! Lest you feel 4/15/78 beginneth and endeth too quickly, we've selected highlights from Civic Arena, Pittsburgh, PA, 4/18/78 to satisfy your fancy.

Limited to 25,000 numbered copies, DAVE'S PICKS VOLUME 37: WILLIAMSBURG, VIRGINIA 4/15/78 was recorded by Betty Cantor-Jackson and has been mastered to HDCD specs by Jeffrey Norman. It is guaranteed to sell out - often within hours.

*2 per order. Very limited quantity available.

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50 years ago today…………..

February 23, 1971
Capitol Theater, Port Chester, New York

Set 1: Uncle John's Band-Loser-Playing In The Band-Big Boss Man-China Cat Sunflower>I Know You Rider-Me And Bobby McGee-Bertha-Next Time You See Me-Around And Around-Morning Dew-Sugar Magnolia-Casey Jones

Set 2: Me And My Uncle-Bird Song-Truckin'>drums>The Other One>Wharf Rat-Greatest Story Ever Told-Good Lovin'-Not Fade Away>Goin' Down The Road Feeling Bad>Not Fade Away-Johnny B. Goode

So this is what happens when the Dead take a day off???

The first set has a somewhat loose, ragged feel. Unusual Uncle John’s opener, nice mid set China/Rider, rare 71 Around & Around, late first set Dew. The second set starts out in fairly mellow mode but gets quickly crunchy and just doesn’t let up………….

Underrated and highly recommended!

Rock on!

Doc
The most valuable thing we can do for the psyche, occasionally, is to let it rest, wander, live in the changing light of room, not try to be or do anything whatever…..

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Morning, rockers!!

I could be sweet-talked into giving May a vote for honorable mention...........

May 1, 2, 6, 7, 14, 15 1970
Europe 72
May 13, 20, 26 1973
1974
1977

Maybe April as well............

Just sayin'...................

Rock on!!!

Doc
The gods conceal from men the happiness of death, that they may endure life

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10 years 2 months

In reply to by billy the kid

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As Hendrixfreak pointed out a week or so back, maybe this month and year was so hot because they were recording shows in preparation for what became "Live Dead". Although March and April of this year are pretty good too.

One show I tend to overlook these days in favour of 2/22 and 2/27 , 2/28 is the 2/11 show that came out years ago as a stand alone release. Two sets -each approximately 60 minutes long that burn very brightly indeed. Its been said before that maybe the time restrictions on this show, or shows, enhanced and focussed the energy. Sure sounds like it.

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In reply to by Colin Gould

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Grateful Teas, interesting, thanks Colin.

Let's hope that "very soon" is right around the corner.

He also mentioned Deadhead values, he must not read these threads.

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8 years 10 months

In reply to by bolo24

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Good stuff you all are talking about.

Felt compelled to ask BOLO about the Krewes.

I'd never looked close enough to notice the margins of the '93 Mardi Gras poster until I read BOLO's comment, then I had to look and we have the following Krewes:

Are We Really? & The Art Police Krewe
Fat Tuesday Parade Float Krewes
“Mouse” Kateers Krewe
Dancing Bear Krewe
The Palooka Family Krewe
Rock Med Krewe
GDTS Krewe
Avery Ranch Krewe
ACME Krewe
Krewe of Glam
Krewe of Disco Disciples
Archives Krewe
Kids Room Krewe
Floating Lotus Krewe

Whoever guesses Bolo's Krewe and he confirms it, wins some kudos ;)
(BTW no prizes, cuz yeah... I don't have any prizes, but kudos are cool, right?)
NOTE: There's a few more peeps listed on the poster, like Balloon Lady, but the list above reflects all the "Krewes"

Fun note: By coincidence, guess what I was listening to while I was reading this?!?! - 2/23/93
I'd put on Lazy River Road, PITB > Drums to start my day and peruse the Dead world on the internet, read Bolo's post which peaked my interest, looked at the poster and realized, I was listening to that show.
Cosmic?
Are we all connected?
Or am I still tripping after watching Oteil's podcast with Bobby & Paul Stamets?
(A must watch / listen for all mushroom & consciousness fans)

You all are fun to hang with, keep it up.

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4 years 3 months

In reply to by The Good Ole G…

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I love that kind of stuff

and

shouldn't it be kewdos, instead of kudos?

hahaha...ha...

I am still not a robot, y'all

slave to "find the taffic lights"

kind of like the "hidden pictures" in Highlights from kid-hood.

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8 years 10 months

In reply to by proudfoot

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RE: PROUDFOOT
Haha.. good one.
On first glance I read it literally, and thought... did I spell Kudos wrong?

As a Dad.. I should get that Dad style joke ;)
Krewe-dos to you!

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In reply to by The Good Ole G…

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Warfield 1980

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In reply to by Oroborous

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True

EDIT: Oh wait... thought you said RCMH

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16 years
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I like to think that while Jeffrey was mixing these two releases last year at TRI that he also mixed down some other tracks while they had the studio.

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4 years 3 months

In reply to by Oroborous

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That would be sweet

The sound quality from show to show (and even within the same show) varies greatly.

Primo
Fuzzy
within a shoebox
decent
hot
sleepy

the thing of it is, is...the acoustic stuff is nice, but same-y setlists

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Anyone watch Freaks and Geeks from 2000? If not, it is on Hulu right now and it is EXCELLENT. An unknown Seth Rogan and Jason Segel star. Show takes place in 1980, so music is a big part of it. In a scene last night, this beautiful deadhead girl asks to borrow a chair from Seth's character, and he turns to his friends and says, "Grateful Dead, terrible music, super hot chicks." That cracked me up, why they only made one season of Freaks and Geeks is beyond me, it is terrific if you need a show right now.

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Warfield would be grate, but doubtful. The multi-tracks are gone, at least we got a Brent studio out of it!!!!

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17 years 4 months

In reply to by itsburnsy

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.....fingers crossed for a Baked Alaska mini-box. Fits the 1980 mold.

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17 years 4 months

In reply to by itsburnsy

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Long story short my source was going off that tweet we saw weeks ago, I thought he had better intel...sorry.
But there is still that tease...

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7 years 3 months
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I agree DAVEROCK, that 2-disc set is fantastic, and thanks for reminding me to dig it out and dig it!! The sets were short because I believe they were opening for Janis Joplin those 2 nights. I wish they would release the other night's 2 sets also.
And my 2 cents on hot months would be Aug-Sept. They were usually well into a tour at this point and the machine was well oiled.

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One of the greatest shows of all time, IMO. The amount of talent on that show, from the actors, the writers, and the creators/producers/directors is pretty astounding. The show originally aired on Fox, and was during the time of the "Reality T.V." boom (ugh...) Reality TV was not only a hit, but was WAY cheaper to make than a fully scripted show, especially an hour-long one like Freaks and Geeks. I've also heard that most of the budget for that show was spent on getting the rights to all of the music, which is a crucial (and awesome) part of the show! Anyway, Fox did what they could to bury the show, moving its timeslot all around, and it eventually ended up airing on Saturday night (the place where TV shows go to die.) The show never developed a following (how could it? No one knew when it was on!) They eventually informed the creators that the show would be cancelled, which is a total crime, as again, it is one of the best things to come out on television, ever. It is only in recent years that people have realized what a true gem that show was, and it has developed a large cult following (kind of like a band I know of...)

Anyway, @itsbrunsey, stick with it! The creators knew that they were getting cancelled, so they did manage to provide a "final" episode that wraps things up nicely - and WHAT an episode it is (YOU ARE GOING TO LOVE IT!... I'm getting a little teary-eyed just thinking about it now.) Oh, and I don't think it is coincidence AT ALL that the main family featured on the show are the Weirs.

Lindsay Weir FOREVER!

Peace

EDIT: I'll also always love how Jason Segal's character is so proud of his drumkit because it has one more piece than Neil Peart's :)

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April 1969 Avalon Ballroom, or Oct 1974 Winterland the complete recordings audio & video. Hopefully, but I wouldn't bet on it.

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In reply to by Mr. Ones

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I listened to this for the first time today - I thought it was crackling with energy. Much surprised, I was. The highlight for me was Let It Grow, but my ears also pricked up during the transition from Not Fade Away to Morning Dew- and Dew itself, of course is also great.
I'll test out the bonus material later on.

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The saga continues. I reached out to Marye directly via mssg about DaP36, as suggested by y'all. She responded today saying "doc (Dr. Rhino) is acutely aware of the situation and DaP36's should be shipping shortly."

Many thanks to Marye. (But if Marye and Doc Rhino are the ones that address customer service questions, why do they have a "help/customer service" link that is unresponsive? I would have still received no meaningful response for 110~ days now if I hadn't found a side-door.)

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Not sure if this has been discussed, but I have noticed that last week on SiriusXM grateful dead channel, I heard a very professionally mixed sounding, phenomenal, Jack Straw, recorded 9/25/80 at the Warfield. And as I sit here now, I am listening to the let it grow, also very professionally mixed and awesome sounding, from that same show. When I look through all my sources, I can’t really find any sort of good source tape for this that circulates out there. So I am thinking that there may have been a little fibbing going on in terms of the notion that all these tapes were destroyed, and that there may be a forthcoming box set from this run. Maybe you all know about it already and I’m way behind.

Reminds me of my one and only trip to San Francisco, back in Summer 1990. The first place we made for, after de-camping, was the City Lights book shop. I still have the carrier bag with City Lights printed on it, as well as the two books I bought - "Howl and Other Poems" and a biography of Neal Cassady by William Plummer called "The Holy Goof."

When we got back home, I found out that The Dead were going to play London at the end of October. I think two shows were announced at first and a third added later.

You walk into the room with your DaP 36 in your hand ...
At least it is happening now, Thin. Hang in there.

As for Lawrence Ferlinghetti, what a wild, crazy ride he took, and for 101 trips around the Sun! You cannot thank the Beats enough for putting words forth for a generation, the echos of which reverberate for ages to come. RIP!

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In reply to by icecrmcnkd

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I’m still holding out that there was supposed to be a second 2020 Box (Fall 80) but it got delayed due to Covid.
Thus, 2 Boxes this year.
Fall 80 and a Pigpen Box.

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50 years ago today…………..

February 24, 1971
Capitol Theater, Port Chester, New York

Set 1: Casey Jones-Me And My Uncle-Cumberland Blues-Next Time You See Me-Bird Song-Me And Bobby McGee-Bertha-Hard To Handle-Loser-Playing In The Band-Good Lovin'

Set 2: Sugar Magnolia-King Bee-Greatest Story Ever Told>Johnny B. Goode-Deal-Minglewood Blues-Truckin'-Not Fade Away>Goin' Down The Road Feeling Bad>Not Fade Away>Turn On Your Love Light

Port Chester is coming to a close, in fine style. Folks, this is the Port Chester show you NEVER hear about. But it’s very worthy, and Charlie Miller’s remaster is very fine indeed………..

On paper, one may scoff, “Doc there’s no big jam, where’s my Other One, where’s the Star?”. True enough, but there’s what might be called some “Piggy jamming”. The Dead start out Set 1 high, and there’s some good grease. I dig the positioning of Good Lovin’s to close first sets. Set 2 also starts out high, has rare-in-71 versions of King Bee and Minglewood Blues, and climaxes with mythic appropriateness with an audience participation, good rappin’ Lovelight.

Overall has a loose feel, confident, relaxed, fun. More laid back than the previous evening, but definitely worth a listen!

Take advantage of your situation, fellas!!!

Hail Port Chester!!

Rock on!

Doc
Medicine is my lawful wife and literature my mistress; when I get tired of one, I spend the night with the other………..

Glad to here Marye is on the job and Rhino Dead.net are correcting the cd shipping SNAFUs. Let's pray this pandemic ends and Dead/Rhino cd production values rise!!!

PGHAS1: Please Universe let it be true that the allegedly chopped up Radio City/Warfield tapes emerge in their entirety and Box Sets complete emerge from it. Dare to Dream! Man O Man that would be just exactly perfect. Imagine that Dead.net has been faking us out this whole time regarding long lost Radio City/ Warfield tapes?!?! Awww you guys are such Tricksters/Pranksters!

A Fall MSG N.Y.C. 1979 mini box would be welcomed and would easily sell out. Dave? Are you listening?

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Yes it looks like they got the ABCD release out early so they then had time to get second release out by the end of the year.

Pigpen and Brent boxes that's a whole lot of Hammond B3. Sign me up!

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Another hero passes, who shall take up the torch now? never thought I'd live to be a hundred, what is that like? I have spoken to a few that have reached that milestone and they say if they had a new body, they would do another hundred for sure. Oh to be young and have the wisdom of the ages. With wisdom like that, can you imagine what could be done and what would be done ? Imagine the possibilities The beat goes on and another generation takes the lead....shall we go, you and I, while we can.....into the transitive nightfall of diamonds.
I would love a Radio City or Warfield 80 box set....1980 is one of my favorite years for the Dead.

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16 years 7 months
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Multi-track recordings of J-Straw and LIG appear on the bonus material for the Dead Set remaster in the Beyond Description boxset. Maybe it was one of those? I understand that these are selections that were pulled for possible inclusion on the album so not likely to be a whole show. Would love to be wrong about that!

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Thanks for the background on Freaks and Geeks, I didn't watch it in 2000 so knew none of that. It really is one of the best shows I've ever watched, have the last two episodes queued up for tonight! Also, you are right, the music is fantastic, and the Weir family is probably no coincidence.

Another grate series that only ran one season is High Fidelity, also on Hulu.

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I actually went back and checked the exact dates for from the remaster against the archive. Here they are:

Let It Grow (Weir / Barlow) - October 26, 1980
Sugaree (Garcia / Hunter) - October 26, 1980
C.C. Rider (Rainey) - October 13, 1980
Row Jimmy (Garcia / Hunter) - October 10, 1980
Lazy Lightnin' (Weir / Barlow) - October 13, 1980
Supplication (Weir / Barlow) - October 13, 1980
High Time (Garcia / Hunter) - October 25, 1980
Jack Straw (Weir / Hunter) - October 10, 1980
Shakedown Street (Garcia / Hunter) - October 7, 1980
Not Fade Away (Petty / Holly) - October 4, 1980

For What it's Worth, DeadDisc.com has something slightly different:

Let It Grow (Weir / Barlow) - October 26, 1980
Sugaree (Garcia / Hunter) - October 26, 1980
C.C. Rider (Rainey) - October 31, 1980
Row Jimmy (Garcia / Hunter) - October 10, 1980
Lazy Lightnin' (Weir / Barlow) - October 13, 1980
Supplication (Weir / Barlow) - October 13, 1980
High Time (Garcia / Hunter) - October 25, 1980
Jack Straw (Weir / Hunter) - October 10, 1980
Shakedown Street (Garcia / Hunter) - October 7, 1980
Not Fade Away (Petty / Holly) - October 4, 1980

P.S. Edit. DeadDisc obviously has a typo as CC Rider was not played on 10-31. So it should be 10-13 as I had thought.

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My understanding is that those tracks were taken from 10/26 and 10/10 and so would not explain it. I could be wrong though.

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12 years
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Maybe I missed the DaP 37 glass comments.

Anyway, Just got mine in mail today. The damn thing is really fuckin nice, I mean really, really. I guess I was picturing a glass like grape jelly came in. Thing has some nice weight to it, feels nice in the hand. Like a tall heavy juice glass, like a supersized big heavy weighed shot glass. Bottom of glass has a dave's picks logo in it. Image around glass is mirrored(?), one way the left to right world, the other side of glass is reversed. Nice. Came in it's own colorful little box, one side is "collect all four!",,,, has one of four boxes filled in , with 38, 39 & 40 blank.

I got a feeling it might be very hard to get all four.

But very nice glass indeed!!! Right up there with the hatchet,,,, which I wish I had bought!

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9 years 11 months
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...10/14/80 has been spinning on Sirius since noon today; there indeed is mental telepathy, apparently.

Missed out on the Dave's glass, but did get the long sleeve T. And Dennis, you are right about missing out on the hatchet. I've used it many times to crack open small logs for kindling, and there is a certain satisfaction that comes with a solid swing and slice as I hum along to 'Easy Wind' in my head.

Be Well People.
Sixtus

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7 years 3 months
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Check your PM.

Hey folks......Stay calm, don’t embalm!!

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10 years 8 months
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Swinging an axe, splittin' the firewood, all to "Easy Wind" in your head? Best comment all ... day? week? month? When time starts to bend, go to the timeless: splittin' wood to "Easy Wind." Been there, many years and (gratefully) counting.

Thanks Sixtus! That flash helps bide the time until Dave announces the Fall '72 box, Wake of the Flood 50th w/ Watkins Glen rehearsal tacked on, and 10-21-68 on CD as RSD release.

If I'm going to be wrong, I want to be SPECTACULARLY wrong...

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17 years 4 months

In reply to by hendrixfreak

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....talk about a photo finish.
I'm game.
November though.
I'm a sucker for annys, so I'll just keep on truckin down the thread.
Dick's 22 will rest my weary head.

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16 years
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King's Beach Bowl

Caution>Feedback! ;~)

ps. 2/23/74 this show is amazing! Need to get that show released. Thought it might be #37 maybe #41 or #42 with bonus disk from 2/22?

So, I was thinking about how lucky we continue to be that all this great music has been released over the last 25 plus years. Keep it coming. Then there have been a few head scratchers along the way.

My top choice for that award goes to Dave's Picks #31, 12/3/79. Never have been able to get into this release.
I also need to listen to the Boise show, Dave's Picks #27, again as that one hasn't knocked my socks off either.

What do you all think?

And I love the enthusiasm for a 1980 box set. I think this is the year. 🤠

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4 years 3 months

In reply to by DeadVikes

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you just gotta "look at it right"

12/3/79...last time I checked it out it was kinda meh

but another time earlier I dug it

16th birthday....just about 90 miles away...but I was too young and ignorant to have a clue about it

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9 years 1 month

In reply to by DeadVikes

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ha, Deadvikes, say it ain't so ;)

so yeah, my 2nd show, great show in person (the legendary Uptown) and solid release from that era. When first released I remember being puzzled by several folks lamenting how Jerry didn't want to be there, etc. etc. and I'm like I don't know what you're listening to but it ain't what I'm listening to. I think Jerry is very much present, and his playing is beautiful and nuanced throughout.

4Winds - I think both 2/22/74 and 2/23 are superb shows and should be released in their entirety, full Norman / Plangent, etc.

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