• 8,086 replies
    marye
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    Bolo24 says: An Idea, Perhaps? Since we're all going to have a fair amount of spare time on our hands for the foreseeable future, what about starting another thread where we all listen to the same show/release on a given day and then share impressions afterward? Folks can submit suggestions and one person (not me) picks what we'll all listen to - call it Deadnet Picks or something. Anyway, if this idea is deemed to have merit, I'd suggest one of the loyal regular posters take the lead and do the picking - y'all can decide who. Might be fun. If it does go forward, I nominate Dick's Picks 18 for the first listen. Been talked about here lately, and, had it been a single show rather than a compilation, we'd probably be talking about it in the same conversation as Cornell, Veneta, etc. Or perhaps even Gainesville?? Stay safe and healthy, friends - this planet needs as many Deadheads as possible.

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  • Oroborous
    Joined:
    More shows

    That’s all I ment.
    Everyone’s made good points, and there’s no easy answer.
    I was going for a conversation starter more than just to editorialize.
    Like most things, no easy answers.
    It’s just now that I’m all addicted to this collecting nonsense, I need as many RJ shows as they’ll give us, and I’m afraid things are going to start slowing down, and eventually it won’t be worth it to them, and so many great shows will never get fixed up and released. And don’t you worry 1stshow ole buddy, there’s still plenty of RJ shows in the vault.
    As a rabid nut trying to tag as many of em as I can before I croak, I’m here to tell ya there’s plenty of gold left in them there hills! Yes many are cassette, but the gang has been getting better and better every year at fixing em up!
    And, there’s still lots of DATs and still a decent amount of killer multitracks, all just rotting in the vault!

    I totally get what yer saying, but think of it this way: suppose the summer 78 box was never released and only a couple others from that year. If they came out and said “this is your one chance to get the 20 best of 78”, including those shows in the July box, would you not find some way to get it? For sure, not everyone is going to want all of em, but I think you’d be able to scrape up at least 10k folks who would want at least one or 2?
    Really they should be digitizing them all, or at least the top 20 or 30 from each year that haven’t been released, and have a system where they announce a certain number, or block at a time, and do pre orders, to have inventory control.
    Some shows might sell big, some not so much. Perhaps have a rule that shows that don’t meet a certain threshold won’t get released?
    I guess the solution would involve somehow having a cost effective way to prep them, but pre order so you don’t always have to have such big sales numbers for every show? Perhaps DL like you say, but that hasn’t worked so well, so far anyway…
    Again, no easy answers, and I totally understand other pov. I just would hate to see so much good music not get the treatment it deserves. And yeah, the archive is awesome, but there’s nothing like getting a great show that’s been fully fixed/Normaned!

    Hey DV, where ya been hiding? Good to see ya, and sorry, I won’t mention you know who. It has got to be really tough being a fan. It’d be one thing if they just stunk, but they have potential, if only they could stop beating themselves.
    A well, it’s early still…

  • DeadVikes
    Joined:
    Releases

    Would love to see more shows released. My preference is still CDs.
    It would be interesting to know what the terms of the contract are with Rhino? Are they able to release as much as they want or are there limits?
    Do they even have the ability to release more per year then they currently are? Is Jeffrey Norman able to mix and master much more than he is now. He might need help. Maybe you could assist OB?

    There are some shows they already mixed and mastered that could be released on CD. For example, the two shows from the first Road Trips that they released as digital downloads, 11/5 and 11/6 1979. Also, the shows from the download series.
    Would also be interested in more video. Why not release the shows from the MUATM. They did this with the 91 show in the Giants stadium box, but would love to see the others released at some point. The 91 Chicago show was really good.

    Okay, seems others are talking about 1988 for #48. We will see next month.

  • 1stshow70878
    Joined:
    Box discussion

    I'm a dinosaur as Oro describes it and know zero about streaming and how younger folks get their music, movies, and TV but I'm guessing the Dinos are the ones buying hard copy CDs. My question is, if the '80s and '90s scene was populated by more younger concertgoers in huge stadiums in numbers way beyond the earlier shows shouldn't there be a demand for those shows in a format they like? I'd bet lots of folks will buy a show they attended. Mickey's model may fit that some day. That said, I'm ignoring the fact that some earlier shows had attendance in the 100,000+ range (Englishtown?) but there were just a few of those. I know Dave said that the last increase to 25,000 copies per release would be the last increase and maybe that's the limit for profitability for hard copy. I'm guessing the download option would be more profitable regardless of sales numbers (if they could ever get the damn things to work!) as all you need is a bank of servers and a few tech savvy people to run it. Large box offerings could be done as a pick and choose your favorite with quantity discounts for more shows. I know I won't be buying twenty shows from individual years I don't like as much and there is likely some truth in the theory that a good portion of "the good stuff" has already been released. Seems like, as with many things, tech is going to have to save us in this dilemma. Affordability is key either way. I can't afford $500 boxes even if I like the offering. It's as simple as that. So Mickey, let's get digitizing! Us Dinos will just have to figure out how to download and stream.
    Cheers
    Oh, and the price of the downloads needs to come down. Currently makes no sense if the price is almost the same just without the shipping. No incentive to be green.

  • Oroborous
    Joined:
    Y’all are missing the point…

    I’m not talking about preferences, if I was, I’d be down with Conekids idea.
    I’m talking about the reality of only a somewhat limited number of boxes getting released.
    Their not going to do this forever!!!
    For example, say they only releases 8 or 10 more years at one box a year.
    With 3 show mini boxes that’s only 30 more shows. Plus say 40 more Dave’s. (4x10).
    There’s still way more than 70 great shows in that vault…
    My plan,
    25 for primal 67-70
    15 for 71
    20 for 72
    20 for 73 (at least!
    ? 74 might just be mostly scraps
    20? for 76? Maybe
    77 is already over represented so he can spit the last few out on DaP
    20 for 78
    20 for 79 and 80
    20 for 81 & 82
    20 for 83 & 84
    20 for 85 & 86
    20 for 87 & 88
    20 for 89 including fall tour (alpine should be a stand alone
    90 not sure you’d need to do 20 as it’s already fairly represented?
    20 for 91 & 92
    20 for 93-95
    These plus DaP and special separates and one might say we’ve received most of the best!
    Take pre orders plus run an extra 10% so your not stuck with inventory but have a few for Johnny come latelies…
    You could still make them “limited”…
    Release 2 a year, everybody wins cept maybe the finicky heads who probably won’t buy much more anyway…

    Voila, all hardcore heads gets represented,

    And remember when Mickey made his bold pronouncement about making all shows available (about the same time he said Phil must have got the liver of a jerk) .
    But I’m sure things won’t change, sales eventually will make cost prohibitive and the vault will go to waste, but hey at least we will have most of 77…and four versions of October 74…
    Think about the cruel reality of only 3 to 5 shows a year for only 8 more years….the horror!
    Tic toc…

  • daverock
    Joined:
    Winterland 74 box

    Yes, next year hopefully - vinyl too. Bit of leisure wear to listen to it in. Nice.

    Mini boxes score where you might not want 17 shows or whatever. I wouldn't mind a few shows from Europe 1990, having attended the London ones - but I'm not sure I would want the whole lot !

  • icecrmcnkd
    Joined:
    Winterland Oct 74 Box, and we need more releases Dave/Rhino

    Hopefully it’s moving into production soon so that we get it for the 50th anniversary next year.
    With all the video included.

    I’ll take mini-Boxes.
    3-show mini-Boxes, released once every other month, and not during a month where a DaP is released. Thus, the DaP’s and mini-Boxes would give us a release 10 months out of the year. The other 2 months would be RSD and Black Friday RSD.
    Sounds like a grate plan to me.

  • JimInMD
    Joined:
    Winterland

    Agree..

    Can anyone tell me why we did not get a Winterland '74 Box Set? The box design would, of course, been a mini Wall of Sound.

    Wars have been fought for less.

    Oh, the horror.

  • wilfredtjones
    Joined:
    Winterland Box(es)

    Would you like yours in a mini or mega? 1972, 1977, 1978 still ripe for the picking. Added together that equals mega I'd say. Taken alone some fine mini ones there. I think there's a New Year's 1971 available yet to add...

    P.S. Currently spinning the space jam from 10-18-1978

  • Oroborous
    Joined:
    Stuck in the mud…

    Made through 5/4 and sorta first run of 5/7 (on crappy device while working) But got bogged down this week with mucho fuckery and distractions so lost my pace and mojo, hoping I can catch up this WE…
    ONWARD!

    NO MORE MINI BOXES!
    Every piddly little release is one less possible future box! Like most things there’s only so many, nothing lasts as the pranksters say…
    We’re running outta time so we need huge boxes with the best remaining 20 shows from each year.
    Perhaps more from years they’ve been stingy or ignored.
    This ain’t no party, this ain’t no disco, this ain’t no foolin around…
    Seriously, sales are flat, saturation for some has set in, old heads don’t want any newer stuff and/or are dying off etc, yeah, this could all go away sooner than later. We need to demand more output for the faithful, and stop worrying about the picky folks who only buy limited things. I totally understand not buying things you won’t use, but if we don’t support these releases, eventually, they’ll just stop!!
    They need to quit dicking around, otherwise,…..Smithers, release the hounds, it’s time to quit screwing around and storm the vault! Where the hell is Keithfan anyway? Thought he was getting close? Hear sound of foot tapping…AND,
    Hey Mickey, what happened to “everything’s going to get digitized and you’ll be able to order almost any show” (paraphrasing).

  • daverock
    Joined:
    Mini boxes

    Maybe they could do that with vinyl releases, like they did with The Lyceum shows. Although I get the impression it didn't sell particularly well.
    I tend to segment them myself, when I listen to them, although I'm glad the cds were released in that mammoth box. I listen to most of them every year - but I couldn't do it consecutively, one show another in one chunk. I take all year about it - then come Spring in the following year...start again.

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Bolo24 says: An Idea, Perhaps? Since we're all going to have a fair amount of spare time on our hands for the foreseeable future, what about starting another thread where we all listen to the same show/release on a given day and then share impressions afterward? Folks can submit suggestions and one person (not me) picks what we'll all listen to - call it Deadnet Picks or something. Anyway, if this idea is deemed to have merit, I'd suggest one of the loyal regular posters take the lead and do the picking - y'all can decide who. Might be fun. If it does go forward, I nominate Dick's Picks 18 for the first listen. Been talked about here lately, and, had it been a single show rather than a compilation, we'd probably be talking about it in the same conversation as Cornell, Veneta, etc. Or perhaps even Gainesville?? Stay safe and healthy, friends - this planet needs as many Deadheads as possible.
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I would choose 6/2/95 Shoreline, I was there in the 2nd row and I had a blast!

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Thank goodness.

So I turned back the odometer a year and a few days from 11/22/72 and currently on RT Vol.3, No. 2. Austin 11/15/71 Disc 1. Been awhile since I've walked this neighborhood. At first I think Phil's bass is in fact a bit low in mix and distorted for that era but right now in Casey Jones and everyone's happy here.

7/19/74. 3/26/72. How about both?

On the road yesterday and was listening to DaP 8 - 11/30/80 Fox Theatre Atlanta. Wow that is a sweet show and release. Wish they'd revisit the matrix concept for some of that early '80s material.

All 3 shows in Seattle '95 were really good and lots o' fun. Same for the 2 in '94. Out there in the Northwest I feel like we were a bit removed from some of the decline. To this day I have the what ifs over fact they sound checked Tough Mama prior to 5/24 and Whisky in the Jar(!!) prior to that or another show in same run (don't see that one uploaded on relisten.) But yeah they played excellent Want to Tell > Estimated that 1st night (I was on the rail) and D/S>Wheel night 2 was flat out amazeballs.

Onward!

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Went with 4-2, old CD-R and it sounds nice. Love the sound of lightning bolt.
A good Drums/Space for those who enjoy those.
I went to both nights, it was a good time in the Pyramid.

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thanks DV - really enjoyed getting reacquainted with this RT. Disc 2 in particular had been lost in the ether. Jam out of Not Fade Away has that raw Caution energy that showed up next year in Europe.

bonus disc from 11/14 Ft.Worth later this morning. that's been like forever.

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You lucky dog, those Memphis Pyramid shows were off the hook. I listen to them from time to time, best of that spring run IMO.

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In reply to by icecrmcnkd

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Right on Bluecrow.

I have had to go back and pick up some of the RT Trips that I missed in the past and this one definitely shined for me.

So much great music out there, keep it coming.

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In reply to by DeadVikes

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BlueCrow 5/26/95 is a really sweet show. Dug that, wouldn't mind giving the rest of that run a listen, but sounds like the Sunday show was the highest.
Now ConeKidd talking 4/2/95.
I'm stuck in the mid 90s :)

Actually was able to check out a majority of 7/19/74. Wow!
Don't think I noticed the patch in Let It Grow @ 10:15-11:17 sounded like it needs a lil pitch correction?
But.. what a show.
Thanks for suggesting it DV.

Gonna try and head over to Texas '71 today and see what I been missing.
And then I believe 3/26/72 was a mention as well.

We'll see where the day takes me. But dug the '74 trip.
Of note: Taper's Compendium lists shows to get from '74 as 2/24, 3/23, 6/16, 6/18, 6/23, 6/26, 6/28, 7/19, 9/10, 9/11, 9/20, 10/16, 10/18, 10/19 and between, Dick's, Dave's, Road Trips & GD Movie Sndtrck each of these shows has seen some type of release with the exception of 9/20.
Might have to dust that one off soon.

Good stuff!

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In reply to by The Good Ole G…

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Just some parts of it.

I followed 4-2 with 4-1, which has a Take Me To The River (Pyramid Arena sits on the bank of the Mississippi).
Those were the only shows I saw in spring 95 and they were pretty good.
Give them a play if you have never heard them.

And if you have never heard 3-23-95 give it a play. Has Ole Brucy sitting in and is mighty fine.

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I just finished listening to the complete 1972 Academy of Music seven shows. (Was at 3) . Had never even heard most of the tapes. I own the Dicks Picks 30 CD plus the Dave’s Picks 14. Do not have the Rockin the Rhein bonus disk with Dark Star. It was quite a journey of seven shows seven days in a row. 3/22/72 has Caution and 3/23/72 has a 23 minute Dark Star.
Also listened to 50th Anniversary of 3/14/71 today. Short but sweet. Organ strong in the mix. Also hollow sound of the Camp Randall Field House. Different sound from Capitol Theater to Fillmore West to Wisconsin, same five musicians. Also progression with new songs and five piece.
So far have listened to all the 1971 GD available on relisten on the 50ths . Real phun.

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In reply to by DeadVikes

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Haven't listened to this in at least a couple of years. #830, one of the first with a lower number, not that it matters.
Thanks for checking it out all.

I love the picture of the boys and the Wall on the back of the liner notes, so cool!
Just can't imagine what it would have been like to see them with the Wall of Sound. And some of you lucky people did and are still here to talk about it.

This show is solid, not the best 74 show released to date, but good. I really like the He's Gone into US Blues, WRS, Spanish Jam into Eyes and a good finish. I can not hear that patch in Let is Grow, GOGD, but my ears sometimes don't pick those up.

Dave's #38, coming up around the corner.

Everybody hang loose.

Pretty cool Strider, March 72, that must have been fun.

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In reply to by DeadVikes

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The Other One

Smokes!

Dug it / Dig it

Happy Birthday Phil!

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In reply to by The Good Ole G…

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5 smoking craters :)

that whole 11/14 bonus disc is excellent. weekend listen totally reset my appreciation for RT 3.2.

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In reply to by JimInMD

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Two Fer it is Jim.
Download Series 6 and Dick's 13. 68 and 81. Thanks guys and Happy St. Patrick's Day.

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Time to get green eh? Cough, cough....

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In reply to by Oroborous

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Alright OB... I might have to get my green on for St. Pat's.

Part 1 of Two-fer done.

Cool stuff!

Think it'd be cool if we got a seaside chat tomorrow?

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In reply to by bluecrow

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Crazy Night!

3/31/86 is groovy.

Dug the Caution Jam on DiP V13, bet that Severson version is fun too!
I should prob check that out.

GOGD - I went with the Severson because it was taped from the penalty box, but went back to sample some of the others and think Wise source is better.

PF - rarely wander into '86 but yeah 3/31 looks fun and if you say so :)

(crowd chanting) - Seaside chat!! Seaside chat!!

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In reply to by bluecrow

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Thanks for the Jim Wise recommendation, I'll try and give that a spin.
3/31/86 is a great/fun show, had that tape BITD, that Hand Jive is my favorite and the jam after GDTRFB is epic.
Def worth a visit and good call PF, I enjoyed that!
And I don't know guys, I might like 5/8/81 better.
Slid on that PITB and it rips from there, great Stella Blue too.
Might have to go through that whole show. May '81 & March '86
Good times & good picks today, good day of the green :)

Seaside Chat! Seaside Chat!

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In reply to by The Good Ole G…

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3/17/68 delivered. Short but packed with lysergic energy. Got the first set of 5/6 under my belt. Time to turn the lights down and get down to it.

Seriously.. I had forgotten how off the hook 3/17/68 was. We need more 1968.. if Lemieux keeps stonewalling us I am storming the vault. Who's with me?

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Kudos to you Jim for the great pick for today, Dick's Picks #13. And of course your recall of the Irishman at the start of He's Gone. Pretty powerful. They didn't do many dedications throughout their career.
And this release always delivers. And the hidden Scarlet Fire is not too shabby either. Okay, as an American Irishman, better crack my first beer and I loved the Irish jokes on the other thread.

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In reply to by DeadVikes

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....give me a trebuchet and a lighter and let me do what I do.
I didn't listen to the GD today.
edit.....but I still have time.

Now we're talking. To ensure the right message on cable news, we will need a few thousand volunteers too.. equipped with pitchforks, torches and "Free The Reels" t-shirts and baseball caps.

Who thinks we'll get a Seaside Chat today?!?!

If not today, than maybe next week.

5/6/81 is far out.
It's eluded me on many listens.
Don't get me wrong, love May '81.
And I always liked the jam, but was scratching my head a bit on why this got the nod for release.
I'd listen and shrug, and go and read the Taper's Compendium and reviews and everybody loves it, so I'd think that it was just me being a weirdo.

However, when I went back and listened to the Jim Wise audience recording yesterday, I was totally getting it.
Now, it coulda been the headspace of later in the day vs first thing in the day.
But, this is kind of a first for me, which is why I'm writing about it, cause you know, you listen to a band for 35 years and you still have firsts... that's exciting!

I've read many reviews of people saying they dug the audience recording more because something was missing for them from the SBD.
Being a SBD snob, I kinda dismissed this as nonsense.
But this show might just change my mind.
That all being said, listening to the SBD with a new appreciation and still love that jam after He's Gone.
Good pick!

PS - If you missed 3/31/86 yesterday... Do it!

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In reply to by The Good Ole G…

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Hey, have you ever listened to the official release?

I don't think we will hear anything on the box for a while. Maybe not until May. Hope I am wrong.

Looking back a couple of years for 2019, the Giants Stadium Box was announced on August 1, 2019 and the PNW Box was slated to be announced on August 1, 2018, but it somehow leaked before the announcement.

Do you think we will get a Meet Up At The Movies this year?

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DeadVikes - Mos Def!
That's kinda what I was talking about, I'd listen to the official release and be like.. ok.
But I think I'm feeling the magic even more after visiting that Jim Wise audience.

Just rambling, but I liked this show before, but I think I like it more now.

And in regards to the Seaside Chat, DL posted a picture of an Eagle that he spotted the other day while he was "recording a seaside chat" so I'm thinking we might hear something soon... guess we'll see.

I'm anxious for more GD release news.

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I saw Weir dedicate He's Gone to Len Bias at the Greek in 1986 and I saw Kreutzman dedicate it to Paul Butterfield at Laguna Seca n 1987. Kreutzman had been playing some gigs with Butterfield.

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Interesting. Could be the Seaside Chat for #38.

But, hey, bring on the Box. I am ready for sure.

I might have to check out the audience version of 5/6/81, if you think it sounds even better.

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In reply to by DeadVikes

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Yo DVikes, so not sure it's better... (still a SBD snob)
But definitely give the Jim Wise recording of that show a preview.
I didn't listen to the whole thing, but it just has a different life to it.
I've heard people mention that about Audience recordings before, and this is one of those shows that it's really cool to hear the "live" aspects of.
Gives it new life ;)
Plus Jim got a sweet pull that night.
Nassau must've been a hot time that year fo sure!

And Yeah, peeps were telling me it's too early for a Dave's Picks Announcement... so maybe we'll get some Box news :)

Strider - I need to dust off that 3/18/71 at some point

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give up the box
oh, we need the box
we gotta have that box

my money is WAITING, ptb

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Thinking about a little 4/14/72 for today.
What do you all think?

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Whooo - I love that Tivoli show! Good choice!

I think I might check out 3/19/86 for a bit too. The SQ of the copies I've found are not great (the AUDs are ok, the SBD of Set 1 sounds really muffled to these ears...). However, strong 2nd set, and the first Visions of Johanna (a very sweet one too...)

Also, let's not forget about Winterland 77! An embarrassment of riches!

Have a good one, friends!

Peace

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In reply to by DeadVikes

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Playing ketchup...
3/18/71 as we speak,
then circle back for a better taste of 5/6/81 disc 3, then, at some point I’ll hit 4/14/72.
That 81 has really grown on me over the years. Hope real gone puts that out again as I only have a copy and
A) really dig this show, and B) I’m down to missing hard copies of around 8 DiPs, so hope they keep rereleasing em so I can Phil that hole...forgot about the hot S/F! Where’s that from again?
Could use a big 72 DS, but I MUST get outside today!
I’ve been starting to walk outside when I can (the treadmills not the same...) and it’s probably hitting 60 up here and I’ve been slacking, so.....so the 72 might have to be “on deck” until appropriate time is available.
Yeeshk, also have a whole list of groovy 90s ideas from y’all, oh, and that 3/31/86 too, Doooaahh!
If I’m up for it, maybe I’ll see if there’s more spring 86 shows on YouTube as I enjoyed 3/19 last Friday night.
I’ve also got a few shows I marked that I thought looked like possible off the grid shows for a day when we don’t have anything lined up...

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In reply to by billy the kid

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Len Bias.. a fine Terrapin, and a tragedy.

Gotta admit the incident gave me a different outlook on that drug. Weird memories, that hit close to home.

I'm in. What's not to like about this show. 4/17 is awesome too.

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In reply to by Oroborous

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Just watched that 3/19/86 on YouTube last week, the video is decent considering, but the Audio was pretty good (at least using Auro 3D?)

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In reply to by Oroborous

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Lotsa Caution this week.
Diggin' it.

4/14/72 you say? Ok.

Another good spring '86 is Set 2 from 3/28/86 for those '86ers out there.

Good times and great oldies!

Happy Friday Freaks :)

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TGIF

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In reply to by Strider 808808

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A favorite Pig tune. Under the right conditions it simply blows me away, and how about the Phil factor!.. I haven't gotten there yet for 4.14.... tomorrow.

The Caution from 3/17/68 was spectacular. (well, the China Cat>Eleven>Caution to be exact). Shit that hole mini show left a smoking crater.

When I first listened to the E72 box it was the Dark Star Caution sequences that had my tongue unrolling out of my mouth onto the gravel below my feet. Wowwow stuff.

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In reply to by JimInMD

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back ca. '82 got a very hissy nth generation board of Rotterdam from Dark Star through Uncle Johns. The oddest tape, the VU meter was maxed out on one channel, the needle barely moved on the other, yet through the hiss it was still "balanced." Originally it was tough to get past the oddities of the tape to the music itself. One long hot summer night about 2 am I threw it in a half-assed cassette player, put on a cheap pair of headphones, and turned out the lights. hiss? what hiss? total time machine. came out on the other side just completely and utterly gobsmacked. among other "things" that blew my mind was that Caution and Phil with the pile driver bass. OMFG. totally rewrote what little I thought I "knew" about E72. at the time maybe only other circulating Europe show I had was the Radio Luxemburg broadcast.

side note - Phil quotes Bird Song in the drifting aftermath of the Dark Star meltdown. Bird Song was MIA Fall 71 through Europe.

edit - some neurons appear to have been crossed regarding 3/18 and I can't sort it out without a deep dive in my vault which isn't happening anytime soon.

Onward (into the ether)!