• Post reply
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    Srinivasan.Mut…
    Joined:

    What's Inside:
    7 Previously Unreleased Complete Shows On 20 Discs
    Fox Theatre, St. Louis, MO 12/09/71
    Fox Theatre, St. Louis, MO 12/10/71
    Fox Theatre, St. Louis, MO 10/17/72
    Fox Theatre, St. Louis, MO 10/18/72
    Fox Theatre, St. Louis, MO 10/19/72
    Kiel Auditorium, St. Louis, MO 10/29/73
    Kiel Auditorium, St. Louis, MO 10/30/73
    Sourced from tapes recorded by Rex Jackson, Owsley "Bear" Stanley, and Kidd Candelario
    Mastered in HDCD by Jeffrey Norman
    Restoration and Speed Correction by Plangent Processes
     
    Individually Numbered, Limited Edition of 13,000

    Steamboats and BBQ, ice cream cones and Mardi Gras - are you ready to laissez les bons temps rouler with the "gateway" to the Grateful Dead? Meet us, won't you, in St. Louis for seven complete and previously unreleased Dead concerts that capture the heart of the band's affinity for the River City.
     
    LISTEN TO THE RIVER: ST. LOUIS ’71 ’72 ’73 is a 20CD set featuring five shows from the Fox Theatre - December 9 and 10, 1971; October 17-19, 1972; and two from the Kiel Auditorium - October 29 and 30, 1973. 
     
    The seven shows in the collection span slightly less than two years, but they represent some of the best shows the Grateful Dead played during some of its peak tours. The music tells the story of a band evolving, changing from one sound to another seamlessly, precipitated – in large part – by significant personnel changes in the Dead’s lineup.
     
    The two 1971 shows feature the original Grateful Dead lineup plus newcomer Keith Godchaux on piano. This version of the band would hold together for the next six months as the Dead embarked upon its Europe ’72 tour. By the time the Dead returned to the Fox Theatre less than a year later, they were without Pigpen, who’d played his final show with the Dead at the Hollywood Bowl on June 17, 1972. A year after the exceptional Fox 1972 shows, the Dead came back to St. Louis, but played the much larger Kiel Auditorium, touring behind the release of WAKE OF THE FLOOD, which came out just two weeks before.
     
    All told, the band played 60 different songs during these shows highlighted by blazing romps through “Beat It On Down The Line” and “One More Saturday Night” and wistful takes on “Row Jimmy” and “Brokedown Palace” (whose lyrics give the collection its name). Meanwhile, the copious jamming ebbed and flowed like the mighty Mississippi River on multiple voyages through “The Other One” and “Dark Star.” Naturally, the band paid tribute to one of its favorite rock and rollers and one of St. Louis’ biggest stars by playing Chuck Berry songs at every show in the collection, including Pigpen galloping through “Run Rudolph Run.”  
     
    Each show has been restored and speed corrected using Plangent Processes with mastering by Jeffrey Norman. The collection comes in a slipcase with artwork by Liane Plant and features an 84-page hardbound book as well as other Dead surprises. To set the stage for the music, the liner notes provide several essays about the shows, including one by Sam Cutler, the band’s tour manager during that era, and another by Grateful Dead scholar Nicholas G. Meriwether, among others. 
     
    Due October 1st, LISTEN TO THE RIVER: ST. LOUIS ’71 ’72 ’73, is limited to 13,000 individually numbered copies and available exclusively from Dead.net.

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  • #41
    That Mike
    Joined:
    The Dead Sell Out

    Jerry sitting in a tub of baked beans!?!?

    I think you hit hammer to nail, Oro - it is saturation. Plus, as you pointed out, it is likely more a case with the less hard core Dead Head, in that they may see a certain pattern to these box sets, and just how many “Me And My Uncle” versions does a fan have to own!? For those that are more deeply entrenched in ALL THINGS GRATEFUL DEAD, all the box set releases are worthy of owning. I think DaveRock has an interesting suggestion in going directly to people to canvas them via survey (savvy marketing); anyone reading these threads for a while will notice, for instance, a roaring demand for some 60s material see the light of day.

    To me, if I’m a fan of artist Edward Hopper (I am), I’m going to want to see as much of his art as possible, for my Hopper Fan Boy eyes see subtleties and complexities others maybe wouldn’t; a casual art observer may be content with his “Greatest Hits”, ie - Nighthawks or Chop Suey.

    Regardless, this River box is a winner, as are all the boxes I am fortunate enough to own.

  • #42
    Nick1234
    Default Avatar
    Joined:
    DaveRock surveys

    Funnily enough I remember doing a Survey monkey survey over on LL regarding box sets that people would like to see, a couple of years before the E72 box came out. I included Fox Theatre 72 ( my favourite) but E72 was the clear winner. The general consensus at the time was that it would never happen 😀.

  • #43
    daverock
    Joined:
    Power to the People

    Maybe if the boxes aren't selling out so fast it would be a good idea to do a survey - find out what most people would most like. Maybe at this stage of the game there are more and more people who aren't going to buy literally everything - just shows or eras that they particularly like. So if the powers that be knew what the most wanted eras were, they could focus more on those.
    That's assuming that people still want big box sets, that is. They might something entirely different.

  • #44
    Oroborous
    Joined:
    Or maybe…

    some, the general public, as compared to the hardcore addicts who hang here, have purchased enough of basically, relatively speaking, the same stuff over and over?
    Now don’t get yer panties in a bunch, I love this box, the 2 Dark Star discs alone are worth it to ME! And they all sound good, but those 71 shows sound amazing!
    But my point is there are a shit ton of Deadheads out there who aren’t us, way more that don’t come hang here, or think about the dead anywhere near as much or how we do.
    I agree to all the points you guys have made, but perhaps there are other, additional, bigger factors in why a couple of seemingly instant sell out boxes have languished…burn out and/or satiation?
    Just riffing here, but you have to consider that there are folks who feel they have enough (ok, easy now, I know, I know sacrilege lol) of this relatively small window but high concentration of shows?
    MAYBE that’s why something like Giants sold out so fast? As I say, I agree with what you guys have said, but maybe some folks would like a little more variety? Just a thought. Doesn’t mean your opinion is not valid (holy shit, spell check tried to change that to Vlad! NO, BAD SPELL CHECK!) just means gulp, some people like more and/or other stuff.
    I know I kinda feel this way and I like ALL years! As long as it’s a great show comparatively to its year or tour, I’ll take whatever they’ll give, but I also know I can get burned out on any era if I listen to it too much, but hey, that’s just me.
    Once again I’m probably proving I’m Sargent Shultz ; )

  • #45
    icecrmcnkd
    Joined:
    STL Box is awesome

    A download version is available for those who are shelf-space-challenged, so maybe that contributes to the physical Box not yet being sold out.
    Wonder if the download version will be discontinued when the Box is sold out.

    Dave,
    Time to announce the next Box.

  • #46
    JimInMD
    Joined:
    BCE'd for the win

    Sounds about right.

    I think the boxes take longer to sellout for two reasons.
    - Sticker shock
    - You get some shows you love and a few tangent shows tossed in just because

    I personally really enjoy them, I am not sure there is a stinker in the bunch. It also opens up exposure to things just around the bend that you might not have been shown the light to. Thinking July '78 and the Giants box for example. Really great music and great recordings from shows (with the exception of 7/8/78) that had escaped my attention.

    As for price, the cost per disc is not high, they just contain a shlits ton of music.

    As for the price tag and shelf space dilemmas, so far I have been able to make peace with it all. Which begs the next question, what box will grace our doorsteps this year?

  • #47
    Born Cross Eye…
    Joined:
    When will this St Louis box sell out?

    Who really knows, because I don't. My guess is December 2022. By then we will have another box to buy (if we want it)
    However, this St Louis box has some great music in it.

  • #48
    daverock
    Joined:
    No sell out here

    I wonder if the further we go back in time, the less likely a box is to sell out quickly. I get the impression that a lot of people are more interested in shows-or tours for that matter - where they themselves were present , rather than ones from before their time.
    I'm not personally like that - although I would say that in the years I did see them-1981 and 1990 - I would be more interested in boxes/releases from the European tours than I would from ones on either side of them. But I would still prefer a box from 1969 or 1972 to one 81 or 90. Possibly because it wasn't seeing them live that turned me on to them, it was listening to the records. Also, to come to the crunch, at this moment in time I prefer the music from 69 and 72 to the later dates.

    Incidentally, I don't think there are any long term bands or musicians where I like all their music from across several decades equally. David Bowie, Hawkwind , The Stones and Iggy Pop all come to mind as people whose records I loved during the 60s and 70s - but who I went off to differing degrees as the late 70s- 80s kicked in. It was always the music I liked more than the scene surrounding it. I never felt that by liking a musician/band/style of music that I was joining some kind of club.

    Going back to the Dead, I agree that the 3rd disc of 10/18/72 is the epicentre of the St Louis box.

  • #49
    JimInMD
    Joined:
    Re: Amazed At

    I am not surprised at all this has not sold out. Par for the course for non-1977 or 1972 excellent box sets. PNW, July 78 and many others took sometimes years to sell out. It's interesting as a similar quality show from Dave's Picks for a larger numbered run (where are we now, about 25k) sells out in a few hours.

    I'll take the win, love 72 and 77 but this period scratches my itch, and these shows are quintessential, simply killer.
    Disc 3 of 10/18 is sublime, a single disc worth the price of the whole box. The rest is a bonus.

    I could care less if it never sells out or if nobody buys another copy. I purchased this the first day it was offered, made amends to my budget. All was and is good with the world.

    Edit: I think I thought the same thing when I got FW69, E72 and Winterland 77. So if you miss out, don't look on EBay and you were warned..

  • #50
    Edhead70
    Default Avatar
    Joined:
    im amazed that this box set…

    im amazed that this box set still has not sold out. Was listening to it over the weekend and although the shows a readily available to download they are not this stellar of quality. You can hear everything very clear. You can tell some time was spent remixing these gems. All shows represented in this box set are smoking and take the listener from rocking good time dead to far out, installer travel. If you haven't purchased get it while its still available. Its a chunk a change for sure, but man its owe so sweet and is well worth the price. the other items that come with are interesting and cool mementos, but man the music is outrageous. Enjoy!!

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Submitted by Srinivasan.Mut… on
Forums
Dead Store Products

What's Inside:
7 Previously Unreleased Complete Shows On 20 Discs
Fox Theatre, St. Louis, MO 12/09/71
Fox Theatre, St. Louis, MO 12/10/71
Fox Theatre, St. Louis, MO 10/17/72
Fox Theatre, St. Louis, MO 10/18/72
Fox Theatre, St. Louis, MO 10/19/72
Kiel Auditorium, St. Louis, MO 10/29/73
Kiel Auditorium, St. Louis, MO 10/30/73
Sourced from tapes recorded by Rex Jackson, Owsley "Bear" Stanley, and Kidd Candelario
Mastered in HDCD by Jeffrey Norman
Restoration and Speed Correction by Plangent Processes
 
Individually Numbered, Limited Edition of 13,000

Steamboats and BBQ, ice cream cones and Mardi Gras - are you ready to laissez les bons temps rouler with the "gateway" to the Grateful Dead? Meet us, won't you, in St. Louis for seven complete and previously unreleased Dead concerts that capture the heart of the band's affinity for the River City.
 
LISTEN TO THE RIVER: ST. LOUIS ’71 ’72 ’73 is a 20CD set featuring five shows from the Fox Theatre - December 9 and 10, 1971; October 17-19, 1972; and two from the Kiel Auditorium - October 29 and 30, 1973. 
 
The seven shows in the collection span slightly less than two years, but they represent some of the best shows the Grateful Dead played during some of its peak tours. The music tells the story of a band evolving, changing from one sound to another seamlessly, precipitated – in large part – by significant personnel changes in the Dead’s lineup.
 
The two 1971 shows feature the original Grateful Dead lineup plus newcomer Keith Godchaux on piano. This version of the band would hold together for the next six months as the Dead embarked upon its Europe ’72 tour. By the time the Dead returned to the Fox Theatre less than a year later, they were without Pigpen, who’d played his final show with the Dead at the Hollywood Bowl on June 17, 1972. A year after the exceptional Fox 1972 shows, the Dead came back to St. Louis, but played the much larger Kiel Auditorium, touring behind the release of WAKE OF THE FLOOD, which came out just two weeks before.
 
All told, the band played 60 different songs during these shows highlighted by blazing romps through “Beat It On Down The Line” and “One More Saturday Night” and wistful takes on “Row Jimmy” and “Brokedown Palace” (whose lyrics give the collection its name). Meanwhile, the copious jamming ebbed and flowed like the mighty Mississippi River on multiple voyages through “The Other One” and “Dark Star.” Naturally, the band paid tribute to one of its favorite rock and rollers and one of St. Louis’ biggest stars by playing Chuck Berry songs at every show in the collection, including Pigpen galloping through “Run Rudolph Run.”  
 
Each show has been restored and speed corrected using Plangent Processes with mastering by Jeffrey Norman. The collection comes in a slipcase with artwork by Liane Plant and features an 84-page hardbound book as well as other Dead surprises. To set the stage for the music, the liner notes provide several essays about the shows, including one by Sam Cutler, the band’s tour manager during that era, and another by Grateful Dead scholar Nicholas G. Meriwether, among others. 
 
Due October 1st, LISTEN TO THE RIVER: ST. LOUIS ’71 ’72 ’73, is limited to 13,000 individually numbered copies and available exclusively from Dead.net.

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Submitted by Forensicdoceleven on Sun, 12/05/2021 - 02:08

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50 years ago today…..

December 5, 1971
Felt Forum, New York City, New York

Set 1:Bertha-Beat It On Down The Line-Big Boss Man-Brown-Eyed Women-I Washed My Hands In Muddy Water-Jack Straw-Mr. Charlie-Tennessee Jed-El Paso-Deal-Playing In The Band-Next Time You See Me-Comes A Time-Casey Jones-One More Saturday Night

Set 2: Truckin'-Ramble On Rose-It Hurts Me Too-Sugaree-Sugar Magnolia-Dark Star Jam>Me And My Uncle>Dark Star Jam>Sitting On Top Of The World-Me And Bobby McGee-Big Railroad Blues-Mexicali Blues-You Win Again-Not Fade Away>Goin' Down The Road Feeling Bad>Not Fade Away

Encore: Johnny B. Goode

Deadicated to jrpaulson2009, canonico, pauldaley1, pony, b o, dirtrider5, alain, neveralull, ed.head, ords120, djaspen, manofort, zygster, mistercharlie, saintstevie, rockysgraetful, the tailgunner, doctorpat, and punster61, because weirdness accrues….

A new member of the family, a vote for male chauvinism, the youngest old timer, the erudite strong backbone of the organization, a very very youthful, ebullient and a very very dirty softball player, and the godfather of rock and roll play a show for the ages……

Was there something in the water? One of the greatest, weirdest, most loved, and most bootlegged shows of 1971, which has just about everything 1971 Dead that anybody could reasonably expect---equipment problems, rowdy crowd, rock and roll, Pigpen, cowboy songs, soulful Jerry, ethereal Truckin’, Dark Star, fiery Not Fade Away suite. I have probably gone through more versions of this broadcast than any other single Dead show I’ve ever had. If a clean soundboard were to suddenly surface---and circulate!---I could die a happy man. Truly very, very deserving of official release. Please, TPTB, make it so!!!!

Who was Uncle Sal???

Rock on!!

Doc
This whole world is wild at heart and weird on top…..

Nice quote form David Lynch's "Wild At Heart" below. One of the most imaginative directors I have ever come across. I started watching the third series of "Twin Peaks" again last week - and it really is one of the most unusual things I have ever seen in my life. It seems to bloom out from the collective unconcious completely unchecked. Reminds me a bit of Salavador Dali saying-to paraphrase - that he didnt take drugs, because he WAS drugs. So's "Twin Peaks".

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Submitted by daverock on Sun, 12/05/2021 - 10:49

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Another one from a David Lynch film-Mulholland Drive. Truer today than ever.

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10 years 4 months

Submitted by KeithFan2112 on Sun, 12/05/2021 - 17:58

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That's a huge setlist. When the 12/7/71 Dave's Picks came out, I put Dark Star and Muddy Water in there, along with the best extra stuff from 12/6. Made a unique "reboot" cover and it's been paradise ever since. Looking forward to the 12/5 Full Norman someday, but it's been pushed back a couple of times in lieu of other Autumn shows since the big recovery of tapes to the Vault.

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Submitted by Forensicdoceleven on Mon, 12/06/2021 - 01:29

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50 years ago today……

December 6, 1971
Felt Forum, New York City, New York

Set 1: Truckin'-Loser-Mr. Charlie-Jack Straw-China Cat Sunflower>I Know You Rider-Run Rudolph Run-El Paso-Tennessee Jed-Mexicali Blues-Black Peter-Next Time You See Me-Casey Jones

Set 2: Big Railroad Blues-Me And My Uncle-Ramble On Rose-Playing In The Band-Cryptical Envelopment>drums>The Other One>Me And Bobby McGee>jam>The Other One>jam>Wharf Rat-One More Saturday Night

Encore: Uncle John's Band

Deadicated to GM and JF, because music is essentially built upon primitive memory structures….

Beneath all the madness, a bundle of joy, the Grateful Dead…..

It can be really tough being the show that comes immediately after a classic. While this one isn’t as weird and cosmic as the previous evening, it’s a well played, high quality, enjoyable December show. Not top tier, but still recommended………

One recognizes one's course by discovering the paths that stray from it…..

Rock on!!

Doc
He who binds to himself a joy
Does the winged life destroy
But he who kisses the joy as it flies
Lives in eternity's sun rise…..

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Submitted by KeithFan2112 on Mon, 12/06/2021 - 11:57

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Did a straight run through of 12/6 only. Really enjoy the Hammond / Piano combo on these shows. Highlights for me: Bobby McGee, Wharf Rat, Ramble On Rose, and I'm always up for '71 UJB.

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Submitted by KeithFan2112 on Mon, 12/06/2021 - 14:47

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Anniversary of another great show. We only got the highlights or at least most of the highlights on the Road Trips 2011 bonus disc (heh, don't go- a-buying that one on eBay!). 40+ minute Dark Star gets top billing, but there's a biggie that's not there on the bonus disc: Here Comes Sunshine. Absolutely undoubtedly top 3, weighing in at 15+ minutes and just exactly perfect.

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Submitted by Forensicdoceleven on Tue, 12/07/2021 - 01:18

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50 years ago today…..

December 7, 1971
Felt Forum, New York City, New York

Set 1: Cold Rain & Snow-Beat It On Down The Line-Mr Charlie-Sugaree-Jack Straw-Next Time You See Me-Tennessee Jed-El Paso-Brokedown Palace-Run Rudolph Run-You Win Again-Cumberland Blues-Casey Jones

Set 2: Sugar Magnolia-Ramble On Rose-Big Boss Man-Mexicali Blues-Brown Eyed Women-Me & My Uncle -Smokestack Lightning-Deal-Truckin'-Not Fade Away>Goin’ Down The Road Feelin’ Bad>Not Fade Away

Encore: One More Saturday Night

Deadicated to Alan Richman, because some men's memory is like a box where a man should mingle his jewels with his old shoes…..

A solid, well played, if unspectacular show. For some, the lack of a “big jam” might knock this two a notch or two. There’s some good stuff here, but you have to dig for it. Decent dose of Pigpen (including a rare Smokestack Lightning, which, while good, is not “rave worthy”), cowboy tunes, and an up tempo closing segment. Definitely worth a listen.

You cannot create experience. You must undergo it……

Rock on!!

Doc
The natural effect of sorrow over the dead is to refine and elevate the mind…..

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Submitted by Forensicdoceleven on Tue, 12/07/2021 - 05:58

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Yo! Rockers!!!

KF--I think everybody except you and me are busy napping...................

Rock on!

Doc
Sometimes, only one person is missing, and the whole world seems depopulated.....

just been a bit non-verbal, and pushing through these next two weeks before winter break arrives. The break is nice and welcome, but it squishes tasks up a bunch.

12/5/71 is spectacular
12/6/73 is spectacular
I love love love the LTTR boxset

there are times when we hit some posting doldrums, for sure

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Submitted by 1stshow70878 on Tue, 12/07/2021 - 07:50

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Tried to answer here a few minutes ago and it would not let me sign in, even though I was already signed in to the home page. Weird, but not that unusual. The answer is everyone's over on DaP40, the most recent release has been the go to. I check every morning for Doc's words of wisdom. And the reviews are nice too.
Cheers!

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15 years 11 months

Submitted by estimated-eyes on Tue, 12/07/2021 - 08:11

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Last night gave the 12/10/71 Fox Theater show another listen (discs 2 and 3). What a great Good Lovin' and the jam sequence on disc 3 is spectacular. The Comes a Time might be my favorite version pre-hiatus (those 76 and 77 versions have that soaring solo that really make the song shine)-- really fine playing and singing.

Then i put in 12/7/71 for the commute to work this morning. Got through Sugaree and will play favorites on the way home. Gotta hear the Smokestack today.

I think we are all lost since they took down the Dave's forum. I heard that Jim was wandering aimlessly on an early DOS chatroom that he was able to dig up while others are busy chatting on the Facebook thingy.

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Submitted by JimInMD on Tue, 12/07/2021 - 08:29

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Here too.. I have been reading it all, just a little too busy to participate at the moment.

Funny.... I have a reply to a doc question he wrote last week. When I come up for air, I will put thought to words and finish.

I am enjoying every minute of it and have been (almost) keeping up with the 71 shows. By almost meaning I missed a month or so but am still tracking where I can.

Thanks all.. keep up the good vibes and good spirit. Lord knows we need it, it's much appreciated.

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Submitted by Sixtus_ on Tue, 12/07/2021 - 08:45

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...ha ha sames, I had brought this up yesterday on the DaP 40 board but I actually insisted the 12/6/73 HCS was a top 2, second only to Dick's Picks One/Tampa.
Because we ALL know we can agree THAT ONE is the tippy top tier HCS, amirite.

Sixtus

Yeah, WTF?
Would of dug that more than yet another China-Rider, nothing against, just comparatively speaking.
Think of it: HCS, DS, and that Eyes…I’d never listen to anything else lol.

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Submitted by daverock on Tue, 12/07/2021 - 11:08

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Doc's words of wisdom are usually quotes from other people. The fact that he doesn't credit his sources can give the impression he has written them himself. Purely an oversight, I am sure, with no wish on his behalf, to mislead anyone. He might know a lot about 1971, but he isn't Willam Blake !

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Submitted by billy the kiddd on Tue, 12/07/2021 - 11:11

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30 years ago tonight I was at the Warfield Theatre for the start of a great 3 night run with Garcia & Grisman. These shows were fantastic, when Garcia picked up his banjo that crowd was lit up. Anybody else here on the forum make to these shows? Garcia was in top form. It would be really nice if these shows were released as a box set, very special set of shows.

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Submitted by Forensicdoceleven on Tue, 12/07/2021 - 11:40

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Yo! Rockers!

I have never implied, suggested, hinted at, or claimed that those "words of wisdom" were my own work.

Maybe next time people will think first and contact the person in question, instead of calling them out and flaming them in public..........

Didn't intend to announce this just yet, but I'll be leaving deadnet after January 2, 2022. Hopefully forever. I won't be missing this type of nonsense.................

Just goes to show that no good deed goes unpunished. Oops, sorry, guess I stole that from somebody too. Oscar Wilde, Clare Booth Luce, Billy Wilder, Franklin Pierce Adams, Andrew Mellon. There, happy now?

Doc
People trash talk me (Zlatan Ibrahimovic)

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Submitted by 1stshow70878 on Tue, 12/07/2021 - 12:34

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I certainly knew Doc's words were quotes but I don't think we need footnotes and citations here. A bit formal for this crowd. What I can appreciate is someone who is widely read and can bring that to the comment at hand.
Love it Doc! Keep 'em coming. Most days it's all that's worth reading here, at least to keep me motivated. Always forward, never straight as someone else posted recently. And on that note I do like your opinions Daverock on lots of different music. Grateful to all.
Cheers

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Submitted by JimInMD on Tue, 12/07/2021 - 19:48

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I even recognized a few of them. I enjoyed how they were folded in with the context of the posts in real time, sort of like a transition between songs. Well done, thoughtful and entertaining. Many thanks to the good doctor.

As you were.. back to your regularly scheduled Yellow Dog > Hard to Handle.

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Submitted by KeithFan2112 on Tue, 12/07/2021 - 20:13

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Your post reminds me of the Harvard bar guy from Good Will Hunting. You know which scene I'm talking about - everyone's at the bar having a real hootenanny, and then the Harvard prick walks up and tries to piss on their good time by flexing the 'ol knowledge muscles. But the actual smart guy in the room calls him out as the needy attention prick he is. Sort of what happened with the comedy you started here today. The humor is Doc's reply and the joke's on you. You named one guy - William Blake - and he helps you out with a half dozen more: Oscar Wilde, Clare Booth Luce, Billy Wilder, Franklin Pierce Adams, and Andrew Mellon. I chortled when I read that. You ought to thank him for helping you out with a few others.

Doc's been gracing us with these fine bits of wisdom for months, but we haven't heard from you until today. Did you just figure out he's been quoting people? I'll let you in on a little secret - we already knew! I guess we're.....what? A room full of halfwits you wanted to bring up to speed when the light bulb went on this morning?

I've been reading posts from Doc and you for a few years, and trust me - the man doesn't need to quote anyone to write circles around you, 1971 or otherwise. He does it, I suspect, to entertain and to bring out our "inner-introspective" which I've found to be....a good thing. There is no better deed than to bring a good thing to someone's day.

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Submitted by DeadVikes on Tue, 12/07/2021 - 21:36

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We need more people like you on this site, not less.

Hang in there.

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Submitted by daverock on Wed, 12/08/2021 - 02:20

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Sorry about that, I thought last night after I posted that you probably knew about the quotes. But I'd put my laptop away by then.

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Submitted by daverock on Wed, 12/08/2021 - 02:30

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You've come out fighting! I misinterpreted Ist show's comment about Doc's words of wisdom which he has rightly corrected me about, and which I have duly apologised for. I think you got a bit over emotional there.

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Submitted by dreading on Wed, 12/08/2021 - 05:08

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I disagree that anyone responded out of line. I think if this was the first time you "corrected" somebody than "it was a simple misunderstanding" would be fine. That is not the case. In the past several months you have crossed a line I have noticed on a few occasions and become argumentative about your opinions instead of respectfully disagreeing, and the thing is I noticed on these occasions that your negativity is not in response to something negative (in other words you seem to be the instigator). I thought to myself in the past, that was a little odd for Daverock, he is not usually harsh like that. If this were the first time, it would be tolerable but unacceptable still. Maybe you had a bad day is what I thought. Your comments yesterday were just flat out unnecessary and seem mean spirited. I am not sure where the misunderstanding was on your part, but it's not important now. Your apology came late and seems a little half hearted considering how many people spoke out against your posting. Now it seems you are trying to dismiss somebody's remarks about your behavior as overemotional it seems to me to deflect the spot light. Apologies do not come off as sincere when you shift the focus to someone else. Doc is well respected on these boards because he's a genuinely good guy and KF's reply is what you need to hear. I believe most people enjoy seeing you here (and I do too) but maybe lighten up on people a bit.

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Submitted by daverock on Wed, 12/08/2021 - 05:45

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It's your prerogative to disagree of course - bur my apology to 1stshow was sincere. I simply misinterpreted what he said as implying that he thought Doc's words of wisdom were his own.

My post didnt include any criticsm of Doc himself. I pointed out what is evident in his posts-that he quotes people without credting who, and that he knows a lot about 1971. I didn't say he necessarily should credit his sources, but in not doing so, he runs the risk of misleading people. This is what I, mistakingly as it happens, thought had happened. I went on to say in my original post that if he had mislead people, then I was sure it was unintentional.

Keithfan's post seemed more like a general attack on me, as he felt that I had attacked someone he respects. No harm done at all.

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Submitted by Forensicdoceleven on Wed, 12/08/2021 - 06:00

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Yo! Rockers!!

OMG PLEASE STOP!!!!

So that we may return to the usual nonsensical, often meaningless babble about our favorite garage band..........

Rock on,

Doc
I beg you take courage; the brave soul can mend even disaster.......(Catherine the Great)

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Submitted by Cousins Of The… on Wed, 12/08/2021 - 06:53

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Forgot who recommended this show, but it's excellent. First time I noticed they changed the 2nd chord from a G major to a Em, to match Marty Robbin's version. When did they switch?? This kind of stuff keeps me up at night

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Submitted by proudfoot on Wed, 12/08/2021 - 07:11

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not sure about El Paso chord changes

I have wondered when the big change in lyrics of Comes a Time happened

"the words come out in an angry stream
you hear yourself say things you could never mean
the heat cools down
and you find your mind
you got a lot of words to stand behind"

or something close to that

those lyrics disappeared...when?

that would be a good release
but prolly no soundboard

1969, Dave.

1969.

I think we all know that the written word is easily open to misinterpretation, and that most communication is 'non verbal'. I'm sure if we were all sat around a campfire or wherever chatting most of the recent misunderstandings and upset wouldn't happen, or would be more easily sorted. I know i have both caused upset and been upset by comments on here.
So, please, take a couple of deep breaths if you're contemplating having a go at someone.
This is not the place
Thank you

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Submitted by 1stshow70878 on Wed, 12/08/2021 - 08:36

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In the late 90's when I was forced to listen to a country western FM station over the PA at work all day in a retail store I decided to call in a request during their "classic country" segment in the morning. Didn't know the artist, I told the DJ, but it's called El Paso. He thought that was a great classic and aired Marty right away. Next day I asked for Big River, which he also dug. After about a week of calling in GD country covers he asked where I got these and was I an old timer that remembered them from when they were new. When I told him that I was learning where these great Grateful Dead covers came from there was silence, then he thanked me politely for calling in. I tried a couple more times but clearly he was on to my radical hippy plot and my requests were ignored. But I did learn a lot! It also helped me listen for the modern rock guitar lines in what was passing for country then, and I did develop a taste for rockabilly too. Gotta make it somehow in the dreams you still believe in.
Cheers!

Cousins of the Pioneers: I have a "cousin" who is a masterful telecaster player for Marty Stuart Named "Cousin Kenny" Whitney. He is actually my ex-brother in law's cousin and has some solo work out there too. First saw him playing for Patty Loveless and much later for Lucinda Williams (replaced at times by Doug Pettybone, another great guitarist).

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Submitted by billy the kiddd on Wed, 12/08/2021 - 09:09

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"If you want something for nothing, jerk off": Bob Weir

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Submitted by JimInMD on Wed, 12/08/2021 - 10:02

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Ha.. that's a great one.

I see things are almost back to normal.. Good thing, I was getting ready to do my best Rodney Dangerfield.

Ok.. I have a little catch up to do and I really want to hit Dave's #40 again, then I plan to hit another listen to Listen to the River Sing Sweet Songs. Third try's a charm I say..

Don't visit for a few days and lookey wha' happens...On the other hand a couple of days ago was my 52nd Anniversary of attending Altamont...sheesh...I was planning on heading to a biker bar in town and getting my ass kicked to commerate the day but some snow kept me from traveling....

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Submitted by Vguy72 on Wed, 12/08/2021 - 13:36

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....Pee Wee's Big Adventure immediately came to mind.
"I'm trying to use the phone!"

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Submitted by daverock on Wed, 12/08/2021 - 14:25

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Nappyrags-you may well already have written about this in the past-in which case ignore me-but I wondered if it felt as ghastly being there as it looks in "Gimme Shelter." Granted, the cameras are focussed on the front of the stage, and the crowd looks like it stretches back into the distance, so for most people it may just have been like another festival. The lucky ones. A historic event, though, for sure.

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Submitted by proudfoot on Wed, 12/08/2021 - 14:25

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you were at Altamont? Truly?

The actual event was probably different from the myth, but still...

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Submitted by Cousins Of The… on Wed, 12/08/2021 - 14:34

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Did you mean Cousin Kenny Vaughn perhaps? He's with Marty Stuart's aptly named Fabulous Superlatives. He's amazing! So is the rest of the band.

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Submitted by Cousins Of The… on Wed, 12/08/2021 - 14:42

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D-> Em -> A in 3/4 hungry

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Submitted by 1stshow70878 on Wed, 12/08/2021 - 14:55

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Duh! Yes Kenny Vaughn. I used my ex-brother in law's surname. Hadn't seen him since my sister's wedding where we were very long haired teen ushers when I got to see him play with Loveless in the early 90's. Then lost track of him again until I saw this skinny guy with Buddy Holley glasses tearing it up on Austin City Limits with Lucinda. A lot of paying his dues in Nashville before and in between. Not bad for a long haired rocker gone rockabilly! And Marty Stuart, I think named after Marty Robbins if I have that straight and no slouch himself on guitar, has really helped Cousin Kenny shine. Thanks!
My last 5? All Lucinda Williams (on Ytube) doing covers of Stones, Dylan, Clash, Bobby Gentry, et.al. She slays me.

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