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    18,000 happy Dead Heads could not be wrong. Deer Creek, my how you deliver.

    We're closing the books on DAVE'S PICKS 2021 with not one but two - nearly - complete shows from Noblesville, IN 7/18/90 & 7/19/90. Yes, we've packed it all on four CDs, save for that second night encore which we promise you'll get to hear in the very near future. Sometimes there really is just too much good stuff.

    For now, we'll invite you to cozy up with two exceptional back-to-back shows, shows with precision and clarity, shows with more than a lion's share of exploratory jams, and most importantly, shows that were simply a damn good time for all. Highlights from night one include the bookends of a spectacular "Help>Slip!>Franklin's" and an epically intricate "Morning Dew" followed by a classic cover of "The Weight." Night two, is the sleeper hit, with flawless playing from start to finish, the set list inviting you to find new favorites in top-notch renditions of "Foolish Heart" or "Victim Or The Crime," and if that's not one of the finest versions of "Desolation Row" Bobby ever did do! We would be remiss if we didn't mention that these shows were among Brent's last and they are some of his finest of the era at that.

    Limited to 25,000 numbered copies, DAVE’S PICKS VOL. 40: DEER CREEK MUSIC CENTER, NOBLESVILLE, IN 7/18 & 19/90 was recorded by Dan Healy and has been mastered to HDCD specs by Jeffrey Norman.

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  • jonathan918@GD
    Joined:
    11/15/71

    A top 5 release for me! This show has it all....a very Jerry show indeed!! Enjoy

  • delhead
    Joined:
    First show - loudest show

    My first show was 1975 Outlaws, Roger McGuinn, Eagles.
    Most recent was Buddy Guy

    @nitecat - I saw the Mamas and Papas in the late 80's. They consisted of John Phillips, his daughter (the tv star), Scott McKenzie and some woman whose name escapes me who did the Mama Cass parts. They played in a restaurant in a ritzy wealthy area. There were people in dresses and furs in the crowd. As soon as they started, a group of people went to the restaurant management complaining that they were too loud and asked to have the sound turned down. Of course the band refused so the complainers left. Better for us, as we ended up right in front of the stage. It was a good show.

    Speaking of loud, what was the loudest show you ever attended? (maybe this has already been discussed here). For me it was a tie between Foghat and Neil Young. For Foghat I was in the second row but off to the side, in front of a bank of speakers. they were the opener. I went to the bathroom after their set and put some tissue paper in my ears for the next band.

    Neil Young opened with a nice little acoustic set then came back with Crazy Horse and blew the doors of the place. My ears were ringing for 2 days.

  • hendrixfreak
    Joined:
    Can we change "last" to "latest"?

    Something about "my last concert" gives me the creeps........

    Great freakin' stories! It's hard to be jealous about stuff that occurred so long ago, but still.

    My latest concert was Hot Tuna electric, 28 Feb 2020, Boulder Theater. I had tics to see Los Lobos two weeks later at the same venue, March 14, but five days before it I decided to play it safe and eat the tickets. The band made their decision not to play a day later. (Great minds?)

    Now I have a ticket to see Los Lobos at the Boulder Theater in March 2022 -- two entire years of concerts missed. Not hugely painful in that I've long forsaken the "big" shows (i.e., either huge crowds or expensive tics), but I miss the theater shows and the blues dives and the mingling and what I euphemistically call "dancing" -- doing my best to move my feet to the music with a young sweetie in my arms. Okay, that's ALL I miss!

    Let's give JimInMD honorable mention for the phrase of the day, when he wrote that the GD "set the jello." Man, I wish I could use language like that. That's a phrase I'm going to tuck away for the perfect conversational moment!

  • JimInMD
    Joined:
    First and Last

    The first few were all over the place.. being a teenager and not yet able to drive, we either walked (Merriweather was close) tagged along with a sibling or had my buddies dad drive us. A lot of metal, t-shirts tended to be 3/4 length black sleeves with a white shirt and godawful graphics and a lame ass picture in the middle. Sabbath was my first.. the first half dozen in general were not always that good. Judas Priest was another, looking back it was not my bag.. I saw an early Rush that was a highlight and unfortunately was the only time I saw them. Just before I could drive I caught the Dead at the Baltimore Civic Center and the set the Jell-O for what a live show could be.. Other early shows were CSN, Jethro Tull, The Allman Brothers and a few lesser shows close by.

    The Dead was it for me though and although I saw as much live music as I could both afford and find time for, the good ole GD were the priority.

    It took years to finally get to Hot Tuna and NRPS, but they rank up there in the fun and enjoyment category. ..and isn't that what's all about, having a good time and catching a good experience. I like to think that is what we all carry to these threads.. our spirit of adventure and our our ability to enjoy. Thanks Jerry & Company.

    Oh, my last was David Byrnes American Utopia on Broadway and a week before that D&C at Blossom Music Center.

  • daverock
    Joined:
    The first and the last

    Frighteningly, one of the first bands I ever saw - Hawkwind in February 1973, was also one of the last bands I ever saw, in November 2019. As if that wasn't bad enough, I saw them in most of the intervening years too -sometimes more than once. Doesn't say much for me in terms of personal development ! More dates confirmed too, although I'm still not ready for going to London to see gigs yet. We both have plenty of time left.

  • docmarty
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    Joined:
    First concerts

    3rd June 1971 Royal Albert Hall - The Band - bonus cd on latest version of Stage Fright.
    20th July 1974 Knebworth Festival - Allman Brothers, Van Morrison, Mahavishnu Orchestra, Tim Buckley
    10th Sep 1974 Alexandra Palace - Grateful Dead
    14th Sep 1974 Wembley Stadium - CSNY, Joni Mitchell
    10th Feb 1975 Cambridge - John Martyn

    what a lucky lad i was......

  • Forensicdoceleven
    Joined:
    Twilight is the time we see best…..

    50 years ago today…..

    November 15, 1971
    Austin Municipal Auditorium, Austin, Texas

    Set 1: Truckin'-Bertha-Playing In The Band-Deal-Jack Straw-Loser-Beat It On Down The Line-Dark Star>El Paso>Dark Star>Casey Jones-One More Saturday Night

    Set 2: Me And My Uncle-Ramble On Rose-Mexicali Blues-Brokedown Palace-Me And Bobby McGee-Cumberland Blues-Sugar Magnolia-You Win Again-Not Fade Away>China Cat Sunflower Jam>Goin' Down The Road Feeling Bad>Not Fade Away

    Encore: Johnny B. Goode

    Deadicated to cedarview, GR8FL22, rhodymike, Mr. Jack Straw, Nanno-1974, lebowski99, glynnt54, stoltzfus, dancin dean, and Zomby D Wulf, as memory may be a paradise from which we cannot be driven, it may also be a hell from which we cannot escape……

    Back in the day this was one of the first Fall 71 tapes I ever had, and it was an instant favorite. While yes San Antonio and Fort Worth are very fine, Austin may be the penultimate 1971 Texas Dead show. It oozes quirky gooey goodness, from the blazing opening Truckin’, through a first set Star AND a spontaneous jam, to a great NFA suite with even more jamming. And if you’re a fan of Cumberland Blues (like I am!), this is one smokin’ version! Extremely solid, great show, get it!

    Rock on!!!

    Doc
    The darkness of death is like the evening twilight; it makes all objects appear more lovely to the dying.

  • Vguy72
    Joined:
    My catalytic converter hasn't been stolen....

    ....but I work in the car repair industry, so I've had to replace a few. They are not cheap, due to precious metals.
    And yeah. A lot of parts are on backorder. My clients get very frustrated, as do I. Sigh.
    On a side note, I've noticed that if your weed smells like fruity pebbles, you got some good weed.
    A bit jealous with some of the first shows I've been seeing here. (Live) Music is the best. Unless it's at Astroworld. Fuck man. Some of those cell phone videos of the event are horrifying. As a huge concert goer, that news pissed me off, regardless of the genre. No excuses. I've been in crowd surges before, and they are scary. I appreciate assigned seating these dayz.
    Take A Step Back. It's not rocket science.
    Gratefulgerd posted at 4:20 btw.

  • gratefulgerd
    Joined:
    My First Shows,

    all at the Jahrhunderthalle (GD 1972) or at the Festhalle (GD 1990) Frankfurt:

    Jeff Beck - April 8, 1972
    John Mayall - May 2, 1972
    Emerson Lake & Palmer - June 10, 1972
    The Who - Aug. 11, 1972
    Steppenwolf - Sept 24, 1972
    Ginger Baker - Oct. 16, 1972
    Alice Cooper - Nov. 25, 1972

    Followed by:
    Deep Purple, Ten Years After, Rory Gallagher, Rolling Stones, Chuck Berry…..in 1973

    Cheers G.

  • proudfoot
    Joined:
    First show

    Chicago (soon after Terry Kath's 'departure')
    With
    Orleans (dance with me, i want to be your partner, cant you see)
    And
    John Stewart (theres people out there turning music into gold)

    Summerfest
    Milwaukee
    1979

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18,000 happy Dead Heads could not be wrong. Deer Creek, my how you deliver.

We're closing the books on DAVE'S PICKS 2021 with not one but two - nearly - complete shows from Noblesville, IN 7/18/90 & 7/19/90. Yes, we've packed it all on four CDs, save for that second night encore which we promise you'll get to hear in the very near future. Sometimes there really is just too much good stuff.

For now, we'll invite you to cozy up with two exceptional back-to-back shows, shows with precision and clarity, shows with more than a lion's share of exploratory jams, and most importantly, shows that were simply a damn good time for all. Highlights from night one include the bookends of a spectacular "Help>Slip!>Franklin's" and an epically intricate "Morning Dew" followed by a classic cover of "The Weight." Night two, is the sleeper hit, with flawless playing from start to finish, the set list inviting you to find new favorites in top-notch renditions of "Foolish Heart" or "Victim Or The Crime," and if that's not one of the finest versions of "Desolation Row" Bobby ever did do! We would be remiss if we didn't mention that these shows were among Brent's last and they are some of his finest of the era at that.

Limited to 25,000 numbered copies, DAVE’S PICKS VOL. 40: DEER CREEK MUSIC CENTER, NOBLESVILLE, IN 7/18 & 19/90 was recorded by Dan Healy and has been mastered to HDCD specs by Jeffrey Norman.

At the end of that show, Bob W makes a comment in essence "on this date in 19??, in (somewhere), it rained fish".

I just now saw on a news source that it rained fish in Texarkana today or maybe yesterday

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....I listened to the second set of that Santa Fe show yesterday!
I interpreted it as "raining Phish."

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1). A.P. Carter, 2). Hank Williams., 3), Merle. Haggard, 4). Johnny Cash. My last choice was a tough one, I was going between. Johnny Cash , Buck Owens, and Dolly Parton, all 3 of them could have been there in that spot. "Drink all day, and rock all night"!

Good idea ! Jimmie Rodgers made some beautiful records too. I remember reading somewhere that Howlin' Wolf was so impressed that he attempted to imitate his yodelling. He came nowhere close, but in missing the mark he created his own inimitable sound.

6/10/73
8/1/73
6/9/77
2/27/69

"we're gonna need a bigger mountain"

there is NO WAY to cite best four GD shows. It's simply impossible.

Country music?

Hank
Merle
Johnny
rotating 4th spot

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1.,Folsom Prison Blues, 2). Cocaine Blues ) 3). Ring of Fire), 4) A11 5 ). Tomorrow is Forever. Johnny Cash , Buck Owens , Dolly Parton. "Drink all day and rock all night".

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I don't always listen to country, but when I do it's usually Gram Parsons. Burritos, Byrds, solo albums, it's all great, even the lowest of lo fi boots.

Not sure who else would be on my Rushmore. Johnny Cash, I reckon. Merle fer sure. Beyond that, a lot of the "country" I like is stuff most people probably consider bluegrass. Bill Monroe. Tony Rice.

Last five would be approximately something like:

DaP 17

ABB: Raleigh 2003

Ty Segall: Harmonizer

Roy Hargrove: The Vibe

Christian McBride: Live at the Village Vanguard

Also some Dvorak symphony, can't remember wut number but it was pretty pretty gud.

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In reply to by Crow Told Me

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I like the Gram Parsons albums, too. Which for me lead on to the first 4 or 5 Emmylou Harris albums. Part of the attraction of those, for me, is the guitar playing of James Burton and Albert Lee. A lot of the country music I have I got by accident - tracks cropping up on what I thought were rockabilly compilations. In terms of categorisation, I guess these would be called hillbilly. A lot of crossover between those two.

It seems its impossible to listen to one record, from any genre, from any period, without it leading on to further records-and so on, without end, into infinity. Which could be why I don't go out much. That and Covid.

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Oh yea.. Talk about a band that ended too soon, and Graham Parsons, what was and what could have been.

Love the Burritos, too bad they couldn't have put out more music. And Tony Rice, when I first heard him I was floored. I went down that rabbit hole for about a month without coming out. As we know, Jerry liked him too and we've got the vinyl to prove it (technically the clear polycarbonate plastic substrate that is a CD).

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Longtime traveler (10/1/76 the first}, and still hear new stuff (to me) that surprises me. Brent's "Don't Ned Love" on this week's JOTW. That is why I love that section and the Taper's: these snippets are nice, short interludes to break up the day, and from shows I've mostly not attended nor have heard. Good training for 30 DoD also !!

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Just finished listening to this release several times over the last few days. Whew, what a monster!
First set just bristles with energy. That Suguree is one for the ages.

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77 Sugarees are bristling with energy, and that 5/22/77 is one of the best in the lot.

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I am 69,000% on board with that Dick's Pick's 3 Sugaree...it is absolute, pure near-banjo pickn' bliss; it is definitely my all time favorite. What's interesting is if you go and listen to the version they played just before that version (it was on a later Dick's Pick's double feature...can't remember which number), but THAT version of Sugaree is a clear prototype to the 5/22/77 version, just not as spot-on and tightly played. You hear several similar runs from Jer, just slightly tweaked so when they go and do it on the 22nd it is like the pure, polished version. I love that shit.

Dick's Picks 3 is perhaps the greatest setlist of all of 77, if it were indeed released as the full show. We've debated this many times before but it always sticks with me now that I am familiar with that entire full setlist; it had never occurred to me it was a chop job but that's the benefit of this here team, keeping everyone on top of this important, life-altering knowledge.

Be Well People.
Sixtus

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The only criticism I have of this show which amounts to revisionist history is I wish they had played the Lady with a Fan segment of the Terrapin earlier in the jam and made a sandwich out of it:

Estimated>Lady With A Fan>Eyes>Wharf Rat>Terrapin Reprise>Dew

Just a little fantasy of mine. I always thought a little interlude in the "his job is to shed light not to master" jam there would be way cool.

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In reply to by wadeocu

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Doesn't the Eyes of the World on this one have a decent amount of distortion, wow and flutter at some point? I'd love to somehow get rid of that if it's even possible. There's a bunch of these older Dicks Picks (and Warlocks 89) that would probably benefit from a remaster. Jeffrey Norman has gotten better over the years...

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To Terrapin: Hartford '77 was my first "monster Sugaree", clocking in at around19:30. Didn't think they could top that, but years later I picked up DP 3, and Jerry just rips through the solos, as advertised. That's really the X factor in my mind, because all of the solos are great in those '77 versions (basically); but there is definitely some extra rocket sauce on DP 3. I just gave them both a re-visit to make sure my story checks out. Yep, DP 3 still has more cowbell. Thanks for the reminder guys.

For a different take on Sugaree I really really like the 7 minute E72 versions with Pigpen's Hammond (4/17 is a good one). As Elwood would say - Strong stuff!

Totally with you on the remasters Jim. I would especially like to hear Dick's 7, 19, 24, and 31, (and 35, although I'm not sure how much they can do with those houseboat tapes - I hear distortion on a lot of those tunes). Here's to wishing.

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In reply to by KeithFan2112

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I prefer Hartford to DP3 on that Sugaree. Not sure why, but it just hits the spot for me a bit more, maybe the slower pace. And who would expect 20 min of Sugaree as the longest song of the night? But as May '77 wound down, that's what happened on a few occasions, and in a few weeks, we get another one of those with DaP 41 Baltimore 5/26/77, though it's "just" 15 min in Baltimore and NFA beats it out by almost 2 min, though completely different beasts as NFA is its typical rock rave up, where Sugaree is such an oddly swung song that just lopes along until it explodes at the end, though Jerry is absolutely killing the first extended solo before the power chords of May '77 come into play. Just reinforcing why I love May '77 so much. Songs that were good, solid songs just had a new intensity. I love Jack Straw '71-74, but after a year off, it gets more intense as May trucks along. Tennessee Jed is another one that gets some extra oomph as the tour goes along (my favorite is probably 5/21/77 from DP29 where Jerry employs the MuTron to spice up the solo). Also, so glad we get yet another Terrapin, never enough of those. And High Time. And Jack a Roe. We're a lucky bunch, even if some complain about the wealth of May '77 releases. I'm already more pumped about the first two Dave's of this year than all four of last year's Picks.

And if they were able to re-release DP3 (and some others that were partials) as a full show, I'd happily grab it up.

Edited to add: Funny enough, the only Terrapin Station I've caught with Phil and Friends or other Dead offshoots was the Inspiration part as on DP3, which, I believe, is the only time they did that, and I'm not sure that Phil and Friends ever did just the Inspiration part again, but it was fantastic and so unexpected. Even moreso as it had a Spanish/Arabic feel to it, perhaps transposed to a Phrygian mode?

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12/28/79 Sugaree, opened the show with it , hands down my favorite version,. The whole show was a knockout!

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In reply to by billy the kiddd

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....if Jerry was still alive, he would give him a standing ovation. Then join him onstage. I marvel at that possible alternate timeline. Thang.
And regarding Sugarees, no one has mentioned 10.18.83 Lake Placid first set opener? Shame.

Well been sitting here thinking...ouch...about eleven days ago I took a bad spill on some ice on my driveway...did a half split and ended up flat on my back with my right leg straight out and unfortunately my left leg pinned under me...the top of my left foot was on the ground and i was laying on top of my heel...For the first minute laying on the ground I was like a turtle on it's back...I finally was able to roll over and get up...got back in the car and drove (about five minutes) to our local medical clinic...x-rays showed no breaks anywhere but I had a lot of soft tissue damage...my toes are purple. my leg from just above my thigh on down was pretty much beat up from being stretched way out of shape...still pretty sore, especially my knee...if it doesn't get better by next week I'll have to go into Flagstaff and get an MRI, see if anything got torn...I've had two surgeries in the past on that knee (Miniscus repair)....the Mrs condemmed me to my LazBoy where I've beenb happily listening to various goodies...I don't mend as well as I used to of course...ok back to our regularly scheduled programming....

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Nappyrags, I'm sorry to hear about your fall, that sounds like a real bad fall. I hope that you'll be ok.

Thank you Billy...I just have to take it nice and slow...I don't bounce like I used to...

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In reply to by nappyrags

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Sorry to read about your fall, and I hope you make a hasty recovery. A least with interests like ours it's possible to continue while we are layed up. Must be a lot worse if you have to go jogging every day !

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to you Nappy. You must be made of rubber with that description of how you ended up laying there. Sounded quite contorted. I can't believe you didn't hurt your back too. It brought back memories of my knee dislocation in my 20's hitting a tree skiing at speed. Knee replaced in my mid-50s and doing great now. Best of luck and double mask if you go to the hospital. Just got through a round of that with the wife.
Cheers

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Michael Lang and thanks for the memories. Woodstock was the one that started it all for me, before woodstock, I was a am radio listening kid who had been kept in the dark about rock music. After Woodstock, I could not get enough and had to hear it all and see as many of these great bands as I could.

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In reply to by PT Barnum

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Please excuse my ignorance

Who is he?

One quick search later...

OH.

Three raisings of the glass to him. Salute!

I want the motorcycle he rode in the movie.

No disrespect, but aren’t you a little old to be auditioning for a stunt man role ; )
Be well amigo, HF too!

Look at the silver lining: enjoy that recliner and catch up on yer dead!

Tales of injuries. Rest up, rehab safely.

I've fallen on ice. Anything goes on the landing and rarely is it pretty. I can't say I've had my leg in a boot, but it's only a matter of time.

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Garcia would be happy, he was a huge 49ers fan.

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If there are any philatelists out there you might be interested to hear that in the UK the Royal Mail are issuing a set of commemorative stamps celebrating 60 years of live performances by The Stones. The earliest concert depicted is the free Hyde Park show from 1969 and the latest is from New Jersey in 2019.
They come out on 20th January.

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Time heal all wounds, may yours heal quickly.
Thought this DaP 40 board was gone, missed a ton of stuff the last few weeks apparently.

Country, you said? Too many, but here's a few: George Jones(greatest Country vocalist imo), Connie Smith, Sara Carter, Anita Carter, Delmore Brothers, Roy Acuff, etc
Regarding the Burritos, their first LP after they fired Gram is a classic from start to finish.

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I hope everyone is good. Sorry for your Fall nappyrags.

I am also looking forward to 5/26/77. Never heard that one. Truth be told I am just now getting to Listen To The River 10/30/73. Has anyone been talking about the Playing in the Band? This is what it's all about.

I saw some Rolling Stones talk on here from a couple weeks ago. Live early 70s from Brussels and Texas. I will also suggest picking up the Sticky Fingers Super Deluxe box for live '71. It comes with Get Yer Leeds Lungs Out, Live at The Roundhouse,, and Live at the Marquee. Micky T is the best. Speaking of Taylor, I had the most incredible experience listening to his last studio record, Only Rock and Roll. I always thought it was an average album compared to its predecessors. After all the Stones talk I listened to everything from Beggars Banquet onward and Only Rock 'N Roll never sounded better. I probably have heard this record100 times over the years, but I downloaded the remaster and gave it a go. Side one does not have a weak song. If You Can't Rock Me, Ain't Too Proud To Beg, It's Only Rock 'N Roll, Till the Next Goodbye, and then the side ends with Time Waits For No One, which has some of the best lead work on a Stones record. Even the title track caught me like it was the first time hearing it. Taylor does not play on that song, but shit, listen to Keith. He's always credited with being the riff master (as he should be) but Keef had some great solos too. Anyways side 2 loses some of the magic, but Dance is a hot rock with blistering lead by Mick. I may like it as much as Goats Head Soup now. Will check back in next month.

Bear Family's 6cd "The Sun Country Box" features some gems. Well known names are featured almost as an afterthought, and then with unissued takes -it's not a "best of". As it says in the excellent book enclosed in the box, " An unissued alternative take of a vintage SUN recording is worth many times it's weight in Hot 100 mush." Amen to that. But its the unknown,or little known names that shine brightest. Welcome to the world of Harmonica Frank Floyd.
2022 marks the 70th annivrsary since SUN opened it's doors for the first time, too.

That "Sticky Fingers" box is great, too. The Leeds University gig is up there with Brussels and the Ladies and Gentlemen set from 1972 in my eyes. The bonus disc, featuring outtakes from the parent album and a few songs from the Roundhouse in March 1971 is one of my favourite single Stones cds. Great "Brown Sugar" with Eric Clapton, and extended "Bitch" on here.

And lest it be forgot,country music was a vital ingredient in The Stones gumbo.

On the mend, doing ok...slow and easy does it...the pains in my knee are almost gone...Yay! again thanks...oh, also having troubles with my PC....on it's last legs...took me forever to log in and post here....

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I turned on my old iPod today for the first time in a while and listened to:

‘Bubblegum’ - Mark Lanegan
I particularly like the track ‘Methamphetamine Blues’.
‘Sweetheart of the Rodeo’ - The Byrds
For an old atheist I do enjoy ‘The Christian Life’
‘Burial’ - Burial
Wikipedia describes this as dubstep and who am I to argue. I just know I like it.
‘Exile on Coldharbour Lane’ - Alabama 3
Their first album containing what became the theme music for The Sopranos. This also has an idiosyncratic take on the John Prine song ‘Speed of the sound of loneliness’ and this led me to…
‘Other Voices, Other Rooms’ - Nanci Griffith
… for another version of the song. She had a great voice. I have the John Prine version, but not on the iPod.

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In reply to by Colin Gould

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The Kinks - Muswell Hillbillies
Bobby Timmons - This Here Is Bobby Timmons
Ronnie Earl - Blues Guitar Virtuoso Live In ERurope
The Lovin' Spoonful - Hums
Taj Mahal - The Natch'l Blues

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Perhaps the preceeding spam will have been deleted, making this title totally obscure, hilarious to see that the automated opening page of dead.net transposes and so showcases spam like that.

A belated Happy New Year to all and my everlasting thanks to the good doctor eleven way down there in the sunshine, whose magic goes way beyond music... it has not gone above zero in the last few days here in Vermont. This is when I hover near the woodstove, listen with good headphones, music room cooler than cool.

Christian McBride Sci-Fi
Billy Strings Home
Larry Coryell Shining Hour
Dave Holland Quintet Extended Play Live at Birdland
Dave's Picks Bonus Disc 2021

Hey is it really only a couple weeks before we get to hear Dave's 41 in full Norman? Yahoo!!!

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