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    What a setlist!... Made me jealous of those who saw this era live. Great sound… like ‘77 was yesterday. @derekb192 on 10/1/77, YouTube

    Wow! Just as when you think eyes is gonna go to drums out of the bliss comes dancing! One of my all time fave moments! Not just classic 77 but classic ever dead! - @emrysdavies1215 on 10/1/77, YouTube

    ...this show was off the hook from the very get go. The Casey Jones is the best I've heard... beginning a jam that goes through each member going off on an instrumental solo. The end has them jamming so hard you can no longer hear them singing through it. Now you know you're in trouble (The Good Kind) when a show starts like that... Weirtheir on 10/2/77, Dead.net

    Holy hell, the 10/2/77 Betty Board sounds incredible... I just wanted to pay homage to this unreleased gem, which features the lovely, tight playing you'd expect of a 77 show with some of the highest audio quality I've ever heard ... What a treat. u/monsteroftheweek13 on 10/2/77, Reddit

    I told my mother I was going into Portland with friends. I never told her where I went... @jamesmoore3694 on 10/1/77, YouTube

    We know where you've been and we're taking you back with the twice as nice DAVE'S PICKS VOLUME 45: PARAMOUNT THEATRE, PORTLAND, OR - 10/1/77 & 10/2/77. Back-to-back complete previously unreleased shows on 4CDs? You betcha! Why? Because we couldn't pick one over the other of these two nights that have been described as "fire," "mind-frying," and "crispy" (bit of a theme here) too many times to count. Witness it for yourself when you dig into the inventive medleys and pristine sound, not to mention the first "Dupree's Diamond Blues" since '69 and the first live "Casey Jones" since '74.

    Limited to 25,000 numbered copies, this release was recorded by Betty Cantor-Jackson (with a boost from Bob Menke, more about that in David's video) and has been mastered to HDCD specs by Jeffrey Norman at Mockingbird Mastering. Grab a copy while you can.

    *2 per order. Very limited quantity available.

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  • proudfoot
    Joined:
    5 2 70

    Dix8

    Reeeeeeeeeally good

  • proudfoot
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    Sportskickindanads

    FDU beats Purdue
    #16 offs #1
    Glad I am merely on the outside looking in

  • bluecrow
    Joined:
    40000 Headmen

    couldn't make me change my mind . . . .

    1stshow Along with GO, also Raindog by Stomu Yamashta from year before (pre-Winwood)

    12/89 Forum shows were good 'uns VGuy! And the Ultramatrixes available are excellent. And by the way, your comment about the Knights vs. Blackhawks a few weeks ago had me tune in that night to 'Hawks radio (WGN) for first time in awhile and I've caught almost every game since and its been a fun run to hear. Took down the Bruins a few nights ago, and last night the Preds.

    Not a deep knowledge FloydHead, but a couple of David Gilmour releases that I really really dig post-Floyd are the Live in Concert video from Royal Festival Hall 2002 and Live in Gdansk. Both awesome and beautiful.

    AnotherStoneyEvening - (emphatic) yes

    And from the Aquarium Drunkard site - his take and select cuts from an obscure Wayne Shorter album - Moto Grosso Feio (he had lynked the title track and Iska). Reallyreallyreally fine wine.

  • billy the kiddd
    Joined:
    St. Patrick's Day Grateful Dead

    3/17/67, Winter land , has a version of the Golden Road gotta release this show, 3/17/68, Carousel Ballroom Ballroom, looks cool, 3/17/70 Buffalo, a definite release. C'mon , Dave lets get that music out there.

  • nitecat
    Joined:
    Floyd, Traffic

    Pink Floyd-When they came out I bought Obscured by clouds, Meddle, Ummagumma, then Atom Heart Mother, a real heavy one, then DSOTM, played that over and over, Wish you were here was the last album I really liked. I did like the guitar work on Comfortably Numb.

    Saw them first at the Cow Palace in '75, they first played new songs from WYWH, we guessed wrongly at the names. Second set was entire DSOTM, with the Echoes encore, awesome show!

    I was impressed with their sound system. I thought they ranked up with the Dead in quality of sound that night in the big barn with it's atrocious acoustics. In my mind the Dead and Pink were the two bands that put their money in a quality sound system at the time.

    I recorded that show on a little stereo sony cassette one mic system I had borrowed from my friend, and was so impressed with the results I decided to buy a recorder myself for future shows- the beginning of my stealth concert recording days.

    Saw them at the Oakland Coliseum in '77 when they were flying giant pig balloons over the crowd, another great show.

    Back in the days of standing in line for tickets, toward the end of those days before a lottery for tickets ruined the ability of hard core fans to do the time in line the night before tickets went on sale, we did that very thing, taking turns over night, and scored six seats in the sixth row center at the Oakland Stadium for the No Roger Pink. Great show, taped that too.

    Only time I saw Traffic was at Winterland in 1978. Winwood was so impressive jumping back and forth between keys and guitar and singing so well- great voice. His band was at Outside Lands Festival in GG Park one year, saw him there. Saw him two years ago at the Fox Theater in Oakland, he still had it. For those of you interested in diving deeper in to Traffic, those "original album' repacks offer five of their original albums in a small box for a very reasonable price.

    Last Five

    GOGD 10 /11, 12/ 1983 MSG These are my favorite shows in the new box- very well recorded and strong shows. I've decided to go back to the other four shows for a second listen.

    GOGD 1/1970 "Live in San Diego 1970) bootleg. Originally an FM broadcast. Not bad sound.

    Gene Clark - Gene Clark. Got pretty good reviews, but I was underwhelmed. Will need to listen again.

    Crosby-Nash - Another Stoney Evening. I picked this up after it was mentioned on this forum several times. Thanks, guys, really sweet sounds from these two.

    Steve Miller Band - Brave New World. Early Steve 'guitar' Miller, my favorite time. Nicky Hopkins plays beautiful keys on 'Kow Kow', and surprisingly Paul McCartney sneaks in to play drums ( under the false name of Paul Ramon for the sake of record restrictions) on one of my favorite rockers, "My Dark Hour".

    Fleetwood Mac - Blues Jam in Chicago v2. Another nice opportunity to hear Peter Green and Danny Kerwan sing and play with these blues greats. I need to get v1.

    Neil Young and the Stray Gators - Tascaloosa. A live recording made right after the same band was recording "Harvest" in Neil's Barn. "Harvest Time" the fine documentary released in Theaters last year documents the goings on at the Barn.

    Music IS the best.

    Best to all of you, nitecat.

  • 1stshow70878
    Joined:
    You Guys Are The Best

    Bluecrow with another forgotten gem in my LPs. (double LP)
    GO with Winwood, Al Di Meola, Stomu Yamashta, and others.
    The Japanese music scene is cool. Is it our poster Frank Parry who lives there now?
    GO is up on the turntable next. (when she who must be obeyed goes shopping)
    Thanks everyone and cheers!

  • Vguy72
    Joined:
    12.11.89....

    ....I was also there bluecrow. Good show.

  • bluecrow
    Joined:
    Heavy Traffic

    Low Spark and John Barleycorn were key pieces of vinyl back in the day (nowadays I listen to the CDs but still have the vinyl), but back then right along with those lps for myselfandfriends was a, now long gone, "greatest hits" called Heavy Traffic, bought it as a cut out, that had cool tripped out cover art of shiny reflective flying saucers flying and slicing through a bunch of saguaro cacti. Released in '75 (and still have that one also, very dogeared - Side 1: Dear Mr Fantasy/40 Thousand Headman/Smiling Phases/Shanghai Noodle Factory/Paper Sun. Side 2: Feelin' Alright/Heaven is in Your Mind/Medicated Goo/Coloured Rain/Empty Pages.) Another cool and somewhat obscure piece of Winwood discography from that time was Go (group was led by Stomu Yamashta). Never lucked into Traffic as an opener, haven't seen Steve, but did catch Spencer Davis as a special guest at The Forum (edit -12/10/89 not 12/11). I'm A Man set closer was killer.

  • Chuck
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    Joined:
    Clapton winwood Traffic

    Daverock I remember seeing Clapton right after Jerry Passed away in 1995 in New York and it was an Amazing show. Clapton was my First concert in 1968 Cream in Philadelphia. The next year Blind Faith also in Philly, I saw Traffic in New Your in 1971 or 72 and them the Amazing Clapton/Winwood show around 2008?? also in New York. And somone said that he seemed like a Douche, He does have some strange beliefs but I try not to let people's personal life affect me enjoying their talent of playing music

  • 1stshow70878
    Joined:
    Thanks Mr. Ones

    Well at least it's German rock! LOL
    Celtic Cross was great mellow acoustic.
    Wrong country for today but I'll try the Scottish one next.
    Cheers

    DR and Chuck, saw Clapton in '85, '87, '88, and (no stub) somewhere in the 1990-95 era (PHX) when he had a buzz cut and he and the whole band were in white t-shirts and workwear right down to the yellow Timberland style boots. Not his usual dapper attire. He once said if he weren't a musician he would have wanted to be a fashion designer. Always well dressed. Eric - " Some of these guys show up in track suits. I mean what's it all about?" talking about his respect for some of the blues greats who wore nice suits as most professional performers did BITD. I would have to say he was better every time I saw him. He has said he regrets not doing more with Steve Winwood and bailing out on Blind Faith. So maybe not what some think Oro. We've all made choices and he certainly has helped some folks with his treatment center for addiction which most of his earnings from the Crossroads Festivals have supported.

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What a setlist!... Made me jealous of those who saw this era live. Great sound… like ‘77 was yesterday. @derekb192 on 10/1/77, YouTube

Wow! Just as when you think eyes is gonna go to drums out of the bliss comes dancing! One of my all time fave moments! Not just classic 77 but classic ever dead! - @emrysdavies1215 on 10/1/77, YouTube

...this show was off the hook from the very get go. The Casey Jones is the best I've heard... beginning a jam that goes through each member going off on an instrumental solo. The end has them jamming so hard you can no longer hear them singing through it. Now you know you're in trouble (The Good Kind) when a show starts like that... Weirtheir on 10/2/77, Dead.net

Holy hell, the 10/2/77 Betty Board sounds incredible... I just wanted to pay homage to this unreleased gem, which features the lovely, tight playing you'd expect of a 77 show with some of the highest audio quality I've ever heard ... What a treat. u/monsteroftheweek13 on 10/2/77, Reddit

I told my mother I was going into Portland with friends. I never told her where I went... @jamesmoore3694 on 10/1/77, YouTube

We know where you've been and we're taking you back with the twice as nice DAVE'S PICKS VOLUME 45: PARAMOUNT THEATRE, PORTLAND, OR - 10/1/77 & 10/2/77. Back-to-back complete previously unreleased shows on 4CDs? You betcha! Why? Because we couldn't pick one over the other of these two nights that have been described as "fire," "mind-frying," and "crispy" (bit of a theme here) too many times to count. Witness it for yourself when you dig into the inventive medleys and pristine sound, not to mention the first "Dupree's Diamond Blues" since '69 and the first live "Casey Jones" since '74.

Limited to 25,000 numbered copies, this release was recorded by Betty Cantor-Jackson (with a boost from Bob Menke, more about that in David's video) and has been mastered to HDCD specs by Jeffrey Norman at Mockingbird Mastering. Grab a copy while you can.

*2 per order. Very limited quantity available.

Just received my package with the Portland Shows.
I eventually paid (in France) like 15 bucks, and it ’s my own fault because I would have paid half on line. Wallet is the best place to learn.
Some of you heard this story: In heaven French do the cooking, the policemen are English, German organize everything and Italian do the entertainment.
In hell English do the cooking, the policemen are French, Italian organize everything, German do the entertainment and …Swiss do the shipping.
Anyway collecting dead shows is no more a merry prankster thing.

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Never enough 77.
(whispers)
Never...

Though more of the under-represented years would be nice (if the PB&J are listening).

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Harem Scarem. RGM reissue from 1991, never been on vinyl.
Never heard of them. Any thoughts?
Some connection with this album and a TV show.
Cheers, eh?

RV3's new series of releases "Brent's Picks"?

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March & December, still some good music left.

Sheik- I like that line about how the English do the cooking in hell. They could also manage the railways and decide what the drug laws should be.

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The Dutch would be responsible for administration.

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In reply to by billy the kiddd

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Winterland 77 March/December would be a nice haul for sure.
Likewise the remaining Palladium 77 run.
A do-over 5/22 full show release would be swell as well.

Also, an October 74 Winterland box.

Also...

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10/9 and 10/10 would make a nice two-fer. Great auds of both days available on the Archive.

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In reply to by Cousins Of The…

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In the last 15-16 months, 9 Brent shows have been released.
MSG Box
DaP 40, 44

2 more shows with DaP 36.
And the Giants Stadium Box a few years ago.

There is no shortage of Brent releases.

There is a shortage of Bruce releases.

There is a shortage of video releases.

Edit:
The View From The Vault Series gave us some Bruce plus video.

Dave/Rhino,
Time for more video.
Thanks for 6-17-91 on Blu-ray, but don’t stop there.

We need all the video from:
Oct. 74, Oct. 80, European tours, Alpine 89, Tinley Park 90.

Then some selections from 91 starting with Soldier Field.

Thanks in advance.

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In reply to by icecrmcnkd

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without a shipping issue, I’ve had to endure two debacles in a row.

So DaP45 finally arrived today. I have been listening to it all evening.

Remember the scene in the movie Big where all the executives and Josh (Tom Hanks) are meeting to evaluate the merits of the new company toy. At the end of the discussion Josh meekly raises his hand and says, “I don’t get it.”

That’s how I feel about this release.

....I'm not going to mention any names, but how about some 1991-1995?
Guess most of them wouldn't cut the mustard, but I saw plenty of shows then, and I recall some being pretty damn good.
A Vegas Box would be much welcome.
Throw in some dice and playing cards. Limited to seven come eleven of course.
One can hope!
The Sphere is being lit up btw. Test runs.
Edit....what don't you get AJS? Why it was released at all? 🤔
I'm open to a discourse.

Ha...

I have mine but have not had the opportunity to listen. I reserve the right to resurrect my view on 1977 GD upon my listen. 77 shows remind me of my supermodel ex-girlfriend. Practically perfect yet somehow not altogether satisfying.

I'm sure it's absolutely killer. First world problems to be sure.

As you were.

Edit: I really have nothing against '77 GD. When I am in the mood it does magic.

Saw a few really solid shows between 91-95, with 10/19/94 at MSG being one of the best.

Was psyched that they released the Feels Like>Bertha from that show as part of this year’s 30 Daze line up.

The 10/1/94 Boston gig they included in the 30 trips box is also pretty fab.

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In reply to by BedHead77

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Sir James probably summed it up best. It’s oddly unsatisfying.

There’s nothing bad about it, but there’s also nothing overly exciting about it. I thought that even the sound quality was just average.

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In reply to by DeadVikes

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I'd simply like more '68, '69 and '70.

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In reply to by BedHead77

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A live concert can be enjoyed at the time of being there, but that doesn't mean it would make a satisfying recording.
Actually, that applies to releases from all eras, from all bands. But it was posts from people who enjoyed Dead shows between 91-95, and suggested some of those be released that reminded me of the fact.

It works the other way round, too. Some live shows I have been to I haven't enjoyed - but listening to recordings of them later, I realised they were better than I thought they'd been. Even Jerry commented on this phenomena- I think it's in The Dead Movie he recalls not liking their performance on 2/14/68 and throwing Phil down some stairs as a response. He listened to them later, and found them to be... "crackling with energy" I think was the phrase.

From my vast experience of going to Dead shows, I would say there was hardly any relation between being there and listening to live recordings.

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In reply to by daverock

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"in Hell": this story is very "cliché". I heard it on a richard Thompson Dvd, maybe 2000 years of pop music...
Yesterday I was a bit annoyed cause I spent time on the phone and car to get this package. Things have changed since the elephant administration...4 or 5 years ago? I felt like paying tax for a boxset for two shows.

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In reply to by daverock

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it depends of the mood you are in. But most of gd recordings are great, even the 82 cassettes. (dickP32)
If you listen Dylan 's fragments bootleg series vol 17, you can measure the greatness of gd recordings. I had to listen live cd4 more times to appreciate, but there's nothing like the other studio takes. the Dead has built the best show catalogue of all time.

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Hey rockers.............

My parents used to say, "If you can't say anything good about something, don't say anything at all". That's why I'm here not saying anything about anything...................

Portland? Don't get the buzz about all that, but we got our annual 77 so let's move on. But not on to 91-95. Some February 1973 would hit the spot...........

Heaven is my current wife, hell is my ex-wife, purgatory is alimony.............

Rock on,

Doc
If your parents never had children, chances are you won't either......

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Dead releases are like Texas weather, don't like it, wait, it'll change.

There is something for everyone, but everyone won't like everything.

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RIP Burt Bacharach
What the World needs now is Love as true today as the day he wrote it.
Via Con Dios so many tunes from out yesterdays

Lurking lately, now catching up again after last weekends deep deep freeze here in Vermont. Live about 50 air miles from Mount Washington and was paying close attention to the extreme weather, cause there's new plumbing in my unheated, fortunately below grade marginally insulated basement. It was 21 below zero last Saturday morning with 35 mph gusts that night, very happy to be earth sheltered. But all that pales infinitesimally to the tragic situation in Turkey. So though #45 was here, was not in the mood to begin paying attention until now, have not yet completed a first run. First impression was very good to excellent recording, Donna in a good place, agreed it seems a bit drum forward, seems to be slight emphasis on mid bass such there is slight percussive effect not noticed on most other recordings. This is a very minor observation. Glad to have these shows tidied up, good fun, obviously not peak 77. Easily distracted by other posts, totally agree with Oro that when the Dead went to Macintosh power amps, audio was cleaned up by a factor or at least 10X... love those old Fender tube amps when they are run right but there was tube abuse, those 6L6s, EL84s etc output tubes pushed so hard, ran so hot, their distortion figures must have been above the 1-2% range. Now to video, though the VftV series is here along with other commercially released vids, had never thought to look for the June 21, 1971 Chateau d'Herouville show and was pleased to find it this morning on utu be. House party on the lawn. Bit rough and raw, hand held cameras, for such a location, the audio is good and there's an excellent Hard to Handle, pig in fine form. Worth checking out.

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50 years ago today I wasn't at Maples Pavilion up in Palo Alto. ( I'm sure I was doing something that was just as fun), but my brother was there and he had a blast!. This show would make a great release.

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when Doc and Dennis just handled it all.

Except, what about Jer on Disc One?? He's ripping!

Haven't spun the shows yet. Just dipped toe. More toes tonight.

Arrived this morning. Good to see it in the flesh, as it were, after having looked at it's picture so many times on the board. I have only played the 1st cd, and I did enjoy it - crisp and clear with plenty of energy. It's neither more nor less than I was expecting really. Possibly a bit more. One of the benefits of reading negative reviews is that it lowers the bar a bit, so that when I do get to hear the offending show, it sounds better than I was expecting. When everyone praises a show it sometimes gives it too much to live up to. And when I do eventually get round to listening to one of those, I can then think that it's not as good as everyone says it is.

Curiously the "Promised Land "-"They Love Each Other" openers appear to be soundboard recordings on my old bootleg. The Promised Land suddenly cuts out after a minute, though.

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I have absolutely no idea how May '77 Cornell became so revered. It sounds/plays like the least interesting show in that run. Real good show. No standout.

Just two cents to augment what daverock said.

From what I've heard so far, I'm going to really enjoy the new pick and not worry how it might be assessed by others. As for ranking shows, I don't have the brain cells to spare.

Most likely because it was the first high-quality soundboard recording that was widely available to the masses. It got everybody hooked. Thank you Betty.

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In reply to by Angry Jack Straw

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This part. Exactly.

First tape I ever owned.

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Yes, this time Dave's Picks arrived in Växjö in less than two weeks!

Got it yesterday, on February 8th, and listen right now to the second CD (second set from October 1st). Good music even though shows from 1977 seems to be a little over-done by now.

I would appreciate more bits and pieces from fall 1966 to 1970 and maybe not as a Dave's Picks volume, I would appreciate a release of June 9-10, 1973.
I have a framed poster above my stereo / TV furniture with a photo of Weir, Lesh and Garcia from one of those shows. Bought it in San Francisco in August or September 1986 and have had it on different walls since I got home to Sweden again. The show from June 10 was one of my first tapes I recieved early in 1985 after having a tape traders ad in the last issue of The Golden Road fanzine in 1984.
But I would prefer something much more superior in sound quality by now. :-)

Well, anyway I'm pleased and grateful for a delivery faster than the seven or eight weeks I normally have to wait for a new DP volume! :-)

Micke Östlund,
Växjö, Sweden

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Just for the record, I've only ever had one....................

In regards to Cornell, it was definitely NOT one of the first high quality boards available to the masses. That's a myth, there were lots of other high quality things----including early stuff. That being said, it WAS one of the first high quality 77s to enter wide circulation. But as many more 77s came out---including the shows right before and right after----some of the luster came off Cornell.

I think Cornell is similar to Veneta---it's one of those "you had to be there" types of things. And, like Veneta, good show, but one of the great great overrated Grateful Dead shows.

Just one man's opinion.......

Rock on,

Doc
He who can no longer pause to wonder and stand rapt in awe, is as good as dead; his eyes are closed......

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Does anyone else hear a muffled voice, like someone on a phone or behind glass say "He's just talking to 1A, come on back." during Black Peter, right at 6:45? Did it come from the disc, or did my computer pick up a nearby call or something.

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Who cares? It either moves you or it doesn't. If it moves you listen again, if it doesn't then move on to something that does. I like some of these picks more than others, but I want them all. I don't have any list of desired releases, and although I love to see shows that I attended released, they are not necessarily the releases that I go back to most often. Really, I just want shows with good sound quality, songs presented in order, and beyond that it is all subjective. One person's good release is another's ho-hum release, which is pretty clear from this thread. I like to listen to a wide variety of music, with a good chunk of it Dead, but there is so much music to listen to, and my enjoyment depends not a bit on how folks rank it.

Burt Bacharach had a ton of great stuff, including some fantastic stuff covered by Isaac Hayes that really hits the spot - Walk on By from Hot Buttered Soul, The Look of Love from ...To Be Continued, and They Long to Be from the classic Black Moses album, some really classic stuff best played a little loud on a good system. Or maybe a lot loud.

Yes, I've just heard it on "Black Peter" too. I think this show, 10/1, is pretty good overall. Some great guitar playing throughout.
I wonder also if shows like Cornell and Veneta gained a reputation because of strongly expressed and publicised opinions affirming their superiority in earlier times. And those opinions became reinforced by others until they became perceived as fact. John Dwork wrote pages and pages about Veneta in The Taping Compendium, whereas some shows on the European tour were summed up in a few paragraphs. Granted, they may not have had the full tapes for some of the European shows, but the impression given is that Veneta is the greatest show of the year - if not of all time. Maybe articles like that, blow shows..like that...out of all proportion.

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Oh, it's there on the disc. It freaked me out when I first heard it in my car zoned in on the commute to work!

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This release to me felt like an old broke in pair of jeans the first time I listened to it. It feels comfortable and makes me feel good. I've listened to it all four or five times now, minus Let it Grow and Cassidy which I generally just do not care for. Bah! Humbug! How dare he.

I have a Nash T52 Telecaster which arrived, brand new, heavily relic'd. I liken this release to it. The guitar played like butter right out of the box like an old friend I just met. I had never heard this show before, but it's what, 46 years old? Older is usually better with cars, wine, whisky, guitars, Dead shows. Hell, my wife is 50 and I wouldn't even trade her for a 20 year old. ;-p

Just a matter of taste I guess. Love this release and can't wait for the next one.

Peace everyone... well, almost.

\m/

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In reply to by LedDed

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Ho
Lee
Phuc

I give up on y'all

I really gotta quit coming to these posting thingies....

Cornell

Great sound and the greatest orgasmic Morning Dew of all time

"You told me goodbye
How was I to know
You didnt mean goodbye
You meant please
Dont let me go"

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In reply to by proudfoot

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....I like the '83 Santa Fe shows. Like. A lot. Definitely whatever rated lol.
I'm just here hoping for a Dave's that is numbered under four digits. One day.
And LedDed. I wouldn't trade my 50+ year old wife for a 20 year old either.
She's hotter and smarter anyways.

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Hey, Nineteen
No, we got nothing in common
No, we can't dance together
No, we can't talk at all
Please take me along, when you slide on down

Yngwie Malmsteen - Relentless
The Flaming Lips - At War With The Mystics
GD - 10.2.77 Portland, OR
The Cult - Love
Deep Purple - Deep Purple In Rock
List works imo....

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In reply to by Vguy72

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....Yo La Tengo just dropped a record. Like, forty minutes ago.
Yessssss

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In reply to by proudfoot

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It always strikes me as ludicrous when people think they have nothing in common with others who disagree with them. The commonality lies in the fact that people understand each other, not that they agree. If I told my neighbour that I thought Veneta or Cornell were overrated, she would neither know nor care what I was talking about. If I said the same thing on here - I'm not assuming anyone would care - but at least a lot of people would understand what I was saying. Whether anyone agreed or not would be interesting to me - but not divisive.

Ledded - that Nash tele sounds alright. I wouldn't mind seeing a picture of that.

I am sure the 50 year old wives find it reassuring that they wouldn't be swopped for 20 years olds. What about when they are 60, though? With a 30 year old ?

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