Grateful Dead

I'm glad you continue to speak out on the whole hi-res file marketing scam. I've tried to do the same here in the past, but you definitely have a talent for explaining it in a more accessible, and diplomatic manner. One good thing I see in Neil Young's Pono service is the promise of greater availability of CD-quality FLAC downloads. That should really be the standard in purchased music downloads, and anything that moves us away from buying MP3s is a step in the right direction.

I still Love LPs. My Nakamichi DRAGON sounds pretty warm to me.Maybe it's just my nostalgia. Then again,maybe not.:)

I haven't looked into the technical specs of the Pono yet, but it would certainly make a difference if they used top of the line components/electronics compared to other devices. For instance, the quality of the built in DAC. If the unit then still allows you to play 16/44.1 files and not just 24/96 and 24/192 files, then it should offer an audible improvement over products that use cheaper components without forcing you into hi res. I will be interested in looking into the pono details - haven't had the time yet. As far as analog warmth, I have yet to hear anything other than vinyl that gives me that. Even though LP's only provide the equivalent of about 11-bit dynamic range, I believe what I've read about the reason for the "warmth", the subtle distortion produced by any sound reproduction medium that requires contact with the medium - distortion from the needle, pressure on the tone arm, etc. Whatever the reason behind what causes it, I think it's largely irreproducible from digital media (unless they digitally record an LP playback! :) Digital files are actually much more accurate to the master recording, have no need of dynamic compression, are clearer, etc. But, there is just something about that LP sound. Maybe it's just nostalgia on my part.

Thanks for the education. I mean that.In my previous Specious post, the bottom line was comparing devices not files - pono vs Ipod. Is it a specious argument that a different device or component will reproduce sound with superiority over another ? Will the pono reproduce sound with greater SQ than my Iphone 6 with the same file in playback ? Are the components used focused on audiophile quality sound reproduction ? Many are critical of Neal Young's pono prior to investigation. Are they the former lovers of Daryl Hannah ? Neal Young is not an electronics engineer or designer. Charles Hansen of Ayre Acoustics is. The pono device is Hansen's brainchild funded by Young. Will the pono player prove to be a portable audiophile device that reproduces any file with transparency, accuracy, as well as an analog warmth that other players lack. Now that they are being delivered to mailboxes worldwide,we shall see. Or hear rather. Specious indeed. Rock on my fellow Deadheads !! PEACE Thanks again for your post wjonjd. It puts a lot in perspective for me.

Hi TN Dead, I think he might mean the following by that: There has been some debate here (and on a couple of other threads) whether Hi Res files make a difference, in the sense of whether anyone can really tell a difference between them and "regular res" for lack of a better term. But, THAT argument concerns "regular" meaning 16/44.1 (CD quality) files versus Hi Res (24/96 or 24/192), and that in that debate it is "Specious" to bring compressed files like MP3 into the argument because it appears many confuse the difference between MP3's and uncompressed files versus the difference between Hi Res and CD Quality files. There was actually one poster not long ago who stated he was a believer in Hi Res because once the difference was audibly pointed out to him between his MP3's and FLAC's he "realized" that Hi Res must be even better. THAT, I think, it was the previous poster meant by "Specious". As it turns out, every scientific study done to date done in a peer-reviewed way has never found a single individual who can actually hear the difference between "Hi Res" files and CD Quality files - even when including in the mix people who swear before hand that they can always hear how much better Hi Res sounds. Not One Person in peer-reviewed studies has ever fared better than 50-50 when comparing the two when the files start from the exact same masters. It turns out it's VERY difficult to do this at home. It has to be completely double-blind for one thing where neither YOU nor any assistants know which file is which until AFTER all the listening. Expectations produce such a HUGE placebo effect that in every peer-reviewed study (again), even when the testers surreptitiously use the EXACT SAME FILE (in other words lie that one is Hi Res and the other is CD Quality), if they allow the listener to "find out" which one Hi Res and which CD quality prior to hearing them, the listeners ALWAYS either say the "Hi Res" one sounds better or that they can't hear the difference; NEVER that the CD quality one sounds better (even though in this case they lied since they were just repeating the same file). You can google some of the studies done to date. I believe the Boston Society of Audio Engineers has done an extensive one, and there are many others done at various universities. The real issue is that most people misunderstand exactly what "Hi Res" files actually are. Hi Res refers to files that are 24 bit (or higher) and done at sampling rates of 96khz or 192khz. The bits refers to how many data bits are used to store each "sample", and the sampling rate is how often a sample is taken - 96khz means 96,000 times per second. It should be noted that NONE of this has anything to do with the terminology used in MP3 compressed files - they are completely irrelevant to the discussion. The Hi Res debate is about comparing those files to 16 bit 44.1 kHz UNCOMPRESSED CD Quality files (CD's use 16 bits and 44.1 kHz). The number of data bits used controls ONLY the dynamic range available to the recording. The more bits the more dynamic range, meaning that you can have more a difference between the softest and loudest sounds. It turns out that 16 bits is enough to go from a sound level of a light bulb several meters away from you (usually the noise floor of wherever you are listening to music is already louder than that), up to the sound level of a jackhammer a foot or so from your head. MUCH more dynamic range than, say, vinyl which would be equivalent to about an 11-bit recording. The sampling rate controls available frequency range that can be recorded. Most people misunderstand the nature of digital audio thinking that because the music is "sampled" in discrete intervals that the more samples the "smoother" the result. This is a misunderstanding. You don't ever get to hear the "samples". The digital to analog converter that the music runs through before it gets to your ears converts the digital information to a sound wave. And, as it turns out from the mathematics behind it all, as long as the sampling rate is at least twice the highest sound frequency you have recorded, then the digital to analog converter can, with 100% (literally) recreate the original smooth sound wave from the source EXACTLY. 44.1khz (44,100 times per second) is fast enough to encode sounds from 20hz to over 22khz. Human hearing, unless you're an infant (seriously) doesn't go beyond this range. So, a 16-bit 44.1khz recording is capable of reproducing music from the source perfectly and no more bits and no higher sampling rate is needed (and never will be) for LISTENING. It turns out that "Hi Res" has actually been around for decades. Where it is useful is in the RECORDING/MASTERING process, because during mastering the engineer may want to manipulate the sound in many ways. Each manipulation introduces "errors" which are cumulative. By STARTING with 24 bits (which inherently has enough dynamic range to LITERALLY make blood come pouring out of your ears if you actually had equipment that respond to highest level), the engineer has "playing room" so to speak to manipulate the recording and then will dither down to 16-bit for the final product. Again, the advantage to 24 bits is in the manipulation of the file. There is no advantage to the LISTENER between a 16-bit and 24-bit file Some people point to the superiority of DVD-Audio and SACD. That is also "specious" because in almost EVERY case, the DVD-Audio discs are made from different (and superior) masters, while SACD is actually a completely different technology (can't go into that one right now), but again are almost always from different masters than the CD releases. To properly compare CD quality audio files to 24/96 files you need to START WITH THE EXACT SAME FILE and then just dither the 24/96 file down to 16/44.1. That is what has been done in the double-blind studies, and not one human being EVER has gotten statistically better than a coin toss trying to distinguish the one from the other, even folks who swear by hi res. Most of these studies involve large numbers of individuals where they purposely get a sampling of audio professionals (audio engineers, musicians, etc.,) laymen who consider themselves audiophiles, as well as a mix of people who don't consider themselves audiophiles. THEN, they listen in a controlled double-blind environment and most of the studies purposely use equipment that ranges from the VERY high end down to the VERY cheap. They account for other variables like using a large range of ages, different types of music, etc. None has ever fared better than a coin toss in this environment. But, you still have folks who swear "I checked, and Hi Res is so much better, man!". If you read some of the studies you will realize how hard it is to do the testing on your own without biasing the test. The reason this all came about is that, like I said, Hi Res has been around for decades, but no one every called it that. It was the resolution used by audio professionals during the mastering phases of producing product for consumers which was converted to CD quality files to put on CD's for general release. Many in the industry recently realized the money potential in convincing people that the hi res files actually SOUND better - people will pay more for the files AND there's all that new equipment to sell. Many people don't even buy music anymore, and many of those that do already have all the CD's they were ever going to buy. By using a new format "hi rez" they can get younger people to pay more, and get older pay to pay again for music they already own. They realized that they can also exploit the fact that very few people really understand digital music technology and will believe that if CD quality files sound better than MP3 compressed files (They do!) then Hi Res files MUST sound better than CD Quality files. In fact, many hi res files DO sound better because the masters used in the original CD quality files suck so bad, and they do a better job mastering before making the Hi Res files. Obviously the real solution is just to master the original music content to the highest standards TO BEGIN WITH. Again, if you start from the same masters, and then just make a Hi Res file and a CD quality file from that same master - NO ONE has been found who can really tell the difference. There will ALWAYS be people who read the marketing garbage and will repeat things like "even though CD quality covers the whole range of human hearing ability, the higher frequencies you can't hear create harmonics that only Hi Res files can store" and stuff like that. But IT ALL COMES DOWN TO, if people can't really HEAR a difference in every controlled study, then there is no difference to YOU THE CONSUMER. There's nothing WRONG with the hi-res files. But, paying more for them, or thinking you're getting better sounding files because there's more bits or a higher sampling rate, is just silly. In light of that, it makes SO much more sense to spend your extra money on BETTER SOUND REPRODUCTION EQUIPMENT - speakers, system, etc. Beyond that, you're just tossing money at a ploy.

I've got nothing.

If you put mp3 on your ipod and lossless on pono of course there is a big difference. That's a specious argument. Unless you are 18 pono is Neil ' s pipe dream

Check out this link for an interesting article about the effects of listening to those nasty, compressed MP3s: http://mic.com/articles/104250/what-the-internet-has-done-to-your-love-…

Highly compressed MP3 files sound terrible. turn those same files into FLAC files and they still sound terrible. Put them on iTunes and play them through your $30.000 sound system. same result.Putting thousands of shows through the compressed file ringer and then throwing away those master audience cassettes. soundboard reels,DAT masters etc... is / was a big mistake. Digital degeneration. Bummer. That being said, Neil and others aim to start with a master source and create a Hi Res reproduction. Not a mistake. I'm sure we all could hear a big difference. Concerning the pono player,its about the build quality of the device or component. ipod vs pono or Mcintosh vs Panasonic . I'm sure we all could hear a big difference

I had a bit of glue on disk 1 of 3/28, I tried to gently clean it off, but it still skipped. About two weeks after contacting customer service I received a replacement. Thank you very much- your prompt and courteous service is greatly appreciated!