Grateful Dead

Just kidding.. The influence of Jazz on GD, at least to me, was/is ever-present.. regardless of era. True, 72-74 was peak.. But there was also the push/pull influences of psychedelics, Bluegrass, Folk, Country, Punk and Disco (yes, I think so), Rock and Roll, R&B, Reggae, Soul, Gospel, Funk and I feel like I forgot something. They symbolized Americana at it's best. But the Jazz pull has always been there, especially in how they communicated and improvised. From 72-74 it's obvious. In the earlier and later years, look for it in segments where Jerry/Phil/Bill circle around each other. I would like to add Bob, it was certainly true in the earlier Gibson years. In the later years he seemed to pivot between the rocker, the country rocker or God forbid the slide rocker.. His influence was edgier (think Victim of The Kind for example, not exactly a Jazz standard). If there ever was an anti-Jazz influence it was Cocaine. I hope I didn't offend, just my take on the topic du jour. They were not a Jazz Band, but the influence has always been there and to my ears was always front and center. Looking forward, I still think there is a strong Jazz influence on what they do today.. Check out a 2018 Eyes of the World for example.. or check out Oteil and Jeff interact..

...would be welcome addition to the retail Dave's Pick canon to these ears. It is definitely a different take and a worthy piece of GoGD History and Mythos to officially document.

Perhaps the best fall '73 show is 9/11/73 William and Mary College (Hornsby's first show). Many of the others have great moments.. and I am sure will see sunlight someday but overall fall a little flat. It could be said the horns have a mind of their own and sometimes don't congeal well with what the band was trying to do at the time. I think there is a cut somewhere in the source reels of W&M though, so it would need the Full-Norman and a patch or two to make the grade. https://archive.org/details/gd73-09-11.sbd.lanum.184.sbeok.shnf

Now this, I like. I have just listened to the Dark Star, being ill informed, to see how it sounded with horns. Obvious now-the horns had gone by this stage. But a great version nonetheless. So much to recommend it-Phils bass at the end nearly blew up my lap top. It also feels quite jazzy, to return to that theme. I really liked Bobs playing round the 10 minute mark. He added so much to the overall sound between 1972 and 1974. Before and since too, of course, but to me, he was at a peak at this time. I often find myself listening to his parts-particularly on those great Playin' in 1972. The great tone he had around that time, and the unusual partial chords he flavoured jams with. Very, very different from accustomed "rock" rhythm guitar. So yes, this would make a great release. Something a bit different from one of the best years.

Glad it's almost the weekend. Some DP 17 discussion. One of my first forays into the Dead was a download of Throwing Stones and The Mighty Quinn. These two lived in my "master Dead list" for years. In those days I hunted down the "best versions" of everything, and also downloaded Throwing Stones from DP 27 and another one, don't recall which, but it had a reprise of the middle jam a few songs later, great stuff. Eventually bought the entire releases. I've had 9/11/73 on my player for a few years, but never listened. I get it stuck in my head sometimes that I should wait for the Full Norman. But now that it's received cool accolades from a couple of renowned online journalists, I've broken the seal. On Dark Star at least. It must be good because I've turned it up twice already. This does kick ass. Billy's the great undersung genius in this band. This is a great sample of his jazz prowess. I listen to something like this on Dark Star, and then pick up hints of it in the rockers they do in their set. Really....good.

as Liberace said "what's better than candelabras on the piano? Tulips on an organ."

...taken from the film/soundtrack, ' Hells Angels Forever' , first appearance of jerry's guitar The Wolf I believe, the soundtrack has two songs performed by Jerry Garcia. Here's the first song, Jerry comes in at the 1:40min. mark.... :) https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WEHogYhhmR8 https://youtu.be/bhcWVStPnmc https://www.discogs.com/Various-Hells-Angels-Forever-The-Soundtrack-Alb…

Would love to hear what you guys think are the highlights of Sept '73. I have completely ignored the horn shows (though I have most of 'em) because I thought the horns sound honky/squeaky, but I guess I didn't realize they were only on a few songs at each show... There's a ton of 2nd set jams there with no horns that I have never listened to :D Sampling 9/11/73 Dark Star as I type and the stereo recording is stunning - nice soundstage. Why haven't I spent more time in Sept '73? I suddenly feel like I just found $100 in my pocket. Thanks..... This Dark Star is gorgeous.

It never ceases to amaze me how many Deadheads are either not into jazz or just not particularly aware of jazz's massive influence on Jerry and the boys. I recommend the following jazz albums without reservation: Coltrane - Love Supreme (deluxe edition) Coltrane - Meditations and/or First Meditations Coltrane - Live Trane -The European Tours box set Coltrane - Sun Ship And, really, any other live Trane from 1961-1966! Also, Miles Bitches' Brew, In a Silent Way, and The Complete Jack Johnson sessions. Here's some of the many quotes direct from the Dead on Trane: Weir: "We felt at that time, when we were listening to Coltrane, that we were hardly fit to grovel at his feet. But still, we were trying to get there - our aims were the same." Lesh: "We never heard Coltrane live after the band started, so it was the recordings we would lean on. Mainly it was Africa/Brass. Bill Kreutzmann really got off on Elvin's drum solo on 'Africa'; of the other guys, it was pretty much the whole composition and the way it all developed, the use of the horns and stuff like that. And then just for the quality of Trane's playing, 'Blues Minor' is one of my favorites." [from the book the House That Trane Built] As for Garcia: "I've been influenced a lot by Coltrane, but I never copped his licks or sat down, listened to records and tried to play his stuff. I've been impressed with that thing of flow, and of making statements that to my ears sound like paragraphs - he'll play along stylistically with a certain kind of tone...for X amount of time - then he'll change the subject, then play along with this other personality coming out, which really impresses me." Lesh says in his book, "I urged the other band members to listen closely to the music of John Coltrane, especially his classic quartet, in which the band would take fairly simple structures ('My Favorite Things', for example) and extend them far beyond their original length with fantastical variations, frequently based on only one chord."

Truckin through end of show is very good. Also listen for Phil during Truckin say, "Howard Cosell said that!!"""

So a few weeks back when this group was discussing who still had their cassette tapes from back in the day, it got me thinking pretty deeply about some tapes I had at one point but have since been lost to the ravages of time. One such tape I was severely thinking on to try to recall where it ended up, was this one portion of a recording I had pulled off of Grateful Dead hour during my sophomore year in college. All i remembered was that it was this really good Truckin' that went into this crazy Other One. I had it written up as: 'Truckin' > Jam > The Other One > Jam' I thought and thought really hard on this but could not determine what happened to that tape, nor did i recall the show from which it had been pulled - I only remember it was likely in the '72-'73 range as it was just Billy in there. Recall, again, that I had not heard this segment in probably 25 years. So, fast forward to this morning. I am driving into work and listening to a newly acquired 'Denver '73' Roads Trips from Real Gone. I put on disc 3, and head to the portion of the shows I hadn't listened to yet. The second Truckin' on disc 3 is moving along nicely, through some very nice crescendos after the lyrics, and into a sweet duel with Phil and Billy. Then The Other One starts, and almost immediately I start to hear things that I know I've heard before. All of a sudden it then takes a turn into utter jazzy territory and I am like: Holy SHIT! THIS IS THAT SEGMENT! I was totally blown away as it further unfolded to my ears, and somehow I was fully aware of what was coming next. All of this after having been lost to oblivion for a quarter century...only to come right back to me all in that moment. A very cool epiphany to be sure...a jazzy one at that....and the luck of the find. Here it is for anyone looking to be moved: https://archive.org/details/gd73-11-20.sbd.hollister.1234.sbeok.shnf/gd… It made for a perfect start to this Nor'easter up here today! Happy Friday Deadfreaks. Sixtus P.S. Jimmy your recollection on that Boston Garden run in '91 is keen, but slightly off. I was actually at the first Friday night show 9/20 but not for any others. But man, I'd love to see that entire run get the full treatment.

I always (half jokingly) say when people mention Kenny G and "jazz", that Kenny is "Jazzy", not "jazz". :-)

March 2, 1969http://gratefuldeadoftheday.com/03-02-1969 Fillmore West San Francisco, California Here we have another outstanding night - the last - from the four-night run at the Fillmore West. The boys go strong right from the start with a Dark Star> Stephen> Eleven. Then they transition into a Lovelight with, of course, Pig wailing to close out the first set. The second set has another incredible Other One suite and then a really long, bluesy, and totally awesome Alligator> Drums> Caution. Like the other three, this show is not to be missed.

Thanks for the heads up on Miles The Complete Jack Johnson sessions. Did not have this one in my collection, it's coming from the library as I type. Thanks.

I don't know it well, but I've always dug the Eyes of the World bonus track from the Wake of the Flood reissue - 9/7/73 at Nassau Coliseum. The sound is crisp and clear, and Jerry's playing exceptionally well. Has been in my top 5 Eyes for some time now.

since I've jumped on board here... I always enjoy reading the different perspectives- some more logical and coherent than others- but almost all are entertaining and bring a new attention to shows/songs. I appreciate it. I missed out on FW Box, but the generosity of the fine members of this community have gotten the music to me and I am sure to others who were seeking it. If I can help anyone get the music, I am more than happy to help. I'm about two days behind the anniversaries, so it's 2/28 for me today- that's a damn fine show. King Bee just did it for me on my way to work today. I would like to have the box, but it's not necessary, and I hope that TPTB don't re-release it. A man is only as good as his word. I truly believe that and it's something I am trying to instill in my sons although they are young. My oldest started Pre-k this fall and one of the questions they asked on a little survey before they started classes was "What is your favorite song?" Without hesitation, he said "Tennessee Jed." Haha! Love that kid and that song. I really like DaP 25 and am looking forward to more '71. Doc turned me on full force to '71, and I am forever grateful. Sorry to ramble. Happy Friday! Bring on Summer of '73 Box!

I attended one of the two shows, 9/7 or 9/8. I clearly recall 'Truckin',' but alas they played it both nights and I'm not positive which show I attended, although I clearly remember getting busted back home after the show (smoking herb in a parked vehicle at 2am) and a trip to the pokey. I kinda think it was the second night, cuz I recall being sad that I missed one, but damn that's a long time ago. Twas a freshly minted 16 year old after a summer of shows: RFK (1 show), Watkins (2), Roosevelt (2). But I'd been to the pokey as a 15-year-old (beer in park), so no biggie.

Came up a short while back. Someone else said they had the album also. Well I instantly found the album in my collection, but, since posting pictures on this site is odd to say the least it's just been sitting here. But what I did do is rip the album in (kind of).Here for your edification is the album in mp3 format. I don't remember who had this album also, but I'm posting a dropbox link to it. Don't EVERYONE jump on this or they will shut off the link because of volume, but WHOEVER had it and would like a copy, have at it, just let me know when gotten so I can reclaim the space. https://www.dropbox.com/sh/zraynk4fqu8dntf/AACz25GHnIwxp_qOU9c8bwk1a?dl…

Hendrixfreak, When are you writing a book? I'll pre-order right now.

Plus, the two Merriweather shows the weekend before! Going to be a Phish-y week! C'mon August... (Sorry, just bought tickets and I am super pumped!) In Dead related news, I've been really enjoying the Closing of Winterland set this week. Disc 3 on paper would seem to be one I would skip (20min Rhythm Devils> 20min NFA>Around and Around) but it is really great! Lots of energy and the added musicians really give the jams that extra "umph." Oh, and Coltrane has been one of my longtime faves! Rumor is that some great live Trane and Miles, (and other jazz greats) can be had if you can find the good Forensic Doctor and ask nicely... He has greatly expanded my collection of mind blowing Jazz recordings! (Thanks again, brother!) Happy (windy) Friday, everyone! Peace

I didn't even tell any stories... but if you scroll back a couple years on this forum, I did post stories from RFK, Watkins (with pics) and Roosevelt Stadium (9-19-72 and 7-31-73 and 8-1-73). If Dave releases a Summer '73 box -- right now, it exists only in my feverish imagination -- I'll bust out a few true tales. Funny, Bolo hasn't been around. It probably takes him a little time to craft those maddening brain teasers about an upcoming release. Wouldn't it be time for one, now that a box announcement must be imminent? And, BTW, the joke is on you. I'm a professional author... new one coming out in May: Working for the Man, Playing in the Band: My years with James Brown (Toronto: ECW Press, 2018). It's a first-person memoir by my guitar teacher, who put in 7 years under JB's tutelage in later years. Strictly what he saw and heard and no BS or speculation or gratuitous dirt. Just the real thing. Please forgive the plug, but you called me out. In the final twist, it's now available for pre-order.

Wheels 6/29/76 5/7/77 5/19/77 5/25/77 2/3/78 * Deals 10/24/71 8/27/72 9/16/78 * 11/30/80 7/19/89

I have the fillmore west and 5/23 & 24th/ 69 grabbed me more and Dicks 24 gets me going more. I know they play everything differently and it was to record a live album but its almost the same set every other night, would a been nice to throw in a china cat or he was a friend of mine.

I remember those tales of old.. they were great posts. One of the reasons I pay attention to these boards is getting show reports, hearing outrageously fun stories and absorbing a bit of the culture. You can learn a bit, laugh a little, smile and get some good ole GD vibe moving through your grey matter. I knew you could write.. but wow. Congrats HendrixFreak. I am not at all surprised to hear about your book. Great news.. .....and those old posts were really fun, thanks for sharing. I have a hard time remember details of the shows I saw all those years ago.

Having listened to the Dark Star from 11th September 1973 this morning, I continued listening to the odds and ends I have from Fillmore West shows 1969 this evening. And got to the Dark Star from 1st March. What an amazing contrast to the 1973 version. Virtually everything is different-from the tone of Jerry's Gibson to the inclusion of Mickey Hart-which seemed to make much more sense pre 1971 than it did post 1974. Tom Constanten seems unusually high in the mix, which adds a sort of stately psychedelic vibe. Bobs presence, however is much more muted, although Phil's counterpoint playing to Jerry' lead is as essential as it was in 1973. I wouldn't want to state a preference for either one-they are both superb in their different ways. Its fascinating how this piece of music alone developed between 1968 and 1974.

Yes, I like to read of peoples experiences at shows from way back, too.And nowadays, even 1995 counts as way back.

I will confess that for every vivid memory -- of which I have many of RFK and Watkins '73 -- there are deep blanks that kinda worry me. We tripped our asses off for two days' in a row at Watkins (not my usual approach for absorbing lessons before going back for more) as it was the thing to do at the time. (That's lame but I've made peace with it over the past 45 years...) Which is to say that 8-31-73 was only 3 freakin' days after 7-28-73 and we managed two more GD shows with The Band opening. My memories of 7-31-73 and 8-1-73 are limited to seeing a girl up on someone's shoulders handing Jer a birthday cake over the lip of the high stage. It was a warm moment, then total darkness claims all other memories of those two great nights of music. That the GD blasted away in style and that we were crisp as hell is a given, but no details any longer emerge. I will say that my dream of a Summer '73 box may be propelled by a wish to recall more, should the recording jog some rusty cog. BUT, if I have to start agitatin' for a SPRING 1971 BOX with my buddy Pig all over it, then hell, let's have TWO FREAKIN' BOXES!!!!!!!!!!!!!! My way of saying, Happy Friday afternoon. (And here's to the upcoming Anthem reissue with (I pray) a sweet '68 show included.) And thanks JimInMD: right back atcha!

this morning, as I listened to 6/14/85, I realized that that show is almost 33 freakin' years old. waaay back. time keeps on slippin' slippin' slippin' into the future check out the Morning Dew from that show, I tell you.

agreed. only get em first 2 songs of Set 2. tasty Dark Star/Morning Dew. worthy of release in the future. 9 11 74 would be nice to have officially as well. 2 shows separated by a year to the day on the experimental tip. all good things......

...Grateful Dead Fillmore West, San Francisco, CA 2/27/69 (4LP 180 Gram Vinyl)(RSD 2018 Exclusive)... ... love it ! :)

mmmmm... timely and interesting. I wonder if it was remastered or if they leaned on Jeffrey's old hard drive for this? Thanks for the scoop.. and have a great weekend.

...your welcome. If I remember correctly it's been remastered, I'll check and see.. - Have a grateful weekend yourself and everyone else on the boards! :) ...the Poster/art for this performance is on fire!. Absolutely beautiful! https://images.wolfgangsvault.com/grateful-dead/poster/memorabilia/BG16… Set list - Good Morning Little School Girl, Doin' That Rag, Cryptical Envelopment-> Drums-> The Other One-> Cryptical Envelopment Dupree's Diamond Blues-> Mountains Of The Moon-> Dark Star-> Saint Stephen-> The Eleven-> Turn On Your Love Light, E: Cosmic Charlie

~ 1.20.79 ~ http://www.deadlists.com/posters/1970s/19790120.html https://archive.org/details/gd1979-01-20.110977.nak700-moore.berger.fla… ~ 5.4.77 ~ "Looks Like Rain" ~ College of William and Mary ~ September 1973 9.21.73 ~ "Black Peter" Pittsburgh ~ 9.24.73 "Deal" ~ 10.25.89 ~ Miami Special request Rhino ~ 5.26.77 and 7.5.81 my sweet Clementine

"Hey man, NO HORNS." to each their own, of course. my biased own is that those horns are annoying. and in general, I don't like "guests" with the GD. I've always been put off by them, going back years. Quirky derp, but true. another curmudgeonly picky Deadhead, y'all

still gotta work that eight-hour day true but it's Friday evening now, bitches!!!

I try really hard not to care what they decide to release.. It's out of my control, and they seem to spend an inordinate amount of effort cleaning up the old, ancient tapes and make them sound better. Why would anyone in their right mind question those efforts? Whatever they come up with, I embrace and after a few listens it gels in my grey matter.. then I decide when and how often I listen to it. I, too, am not a generally a fan of the horn era. I think that's common. But if they released one, I'd pick 9/11 and I would like to think they could clean it up and make it sound much better than the versions on the archive. For $30, I wouldn't second guess it. So the two questions are how much I would like it and how often would I reach for it. No wrong answers.. If they cleaned up the cut in Morning Dew somehow, I do think this would be an interesting release and I would be very willing to give it a chance. Just my opinion.. oh.. and I love the 85 hype being spread recently.. it's catchy and I wholeheartedly agree. Right on it is bleeping Friday! I learned something new in Mexico recently.. Extra Anejo. So make Friday's Extra Anejo Friday's.. at least until the credit card bill comes.

agree with your comments on everyone's sounds and contributions in the Dark Star period, especially "to the inclusion of Mickey Hart-which seemed to make much more sense pre 1971 than it did post 1974." They really did "break up" and reform, more so than a hiatus from touring after October '74. Their whole sound and style made a seismic shift after '74, as if they wanted to shut the door on the past and start over. I prefer the swing to the boom boom boom (but the boom boom boom is still better than every band in the world:) I think Jerry wanted a more rockin' sound. At least I think Jerry was the decision maker, I couldn't say for sure, but I think the Dead always went where Jerry intended. It would have been cool to have stuck with one drummer. I think Bill's style became much simpler when Mickey returned, to the point where all of that great style he expressed as single drummer was completely muted.

I don't think they ever broke up.. just escaped the financial trauma of the WOS and parted ways with Warner. Its more complicated than that.. Coke, Money and Excess is a tidier explanation than breaking up or divorce. They took a year and a half off (expensive) touring, started their own record company and recorded Blues for Allah in Bob's studio. Just my opinion. I don't have favorite era's or whatever.. but 1974 ranks high.. and I completely love the one drummer 1974 period (and love Keith).. but I like Mickey's contributions too. It is what it is and I made peace with all era's a long time ago. I'm just happy they hit record and wish they would have recorded on reels post Betty. Whatever they left for us to listen to now, is heaven scent and I am truly grateful.

Obviously didnt announce they were breaking up, but returned to touring in 1976 as different from their former sound as many bands who breakup, change personnel, and re-establish their sound months or years later. Point being, they shut the door on their old sound.

But the same changes were there between 69 and 70. They were always challenging themselves and changing their sound. To me, that's what makes it Grateful Dead. That's what makes it great.

The change in sound from 74 to 76 was new and sudden. Prior to that, from 67-74 their sound gradually developed into what they were in 1974, with no lengthy breaks from the road, or announced hiatuses. Gradual being the operative word. The change in sound between 74 and 76 was much bigger,and basically occurred all at once. Jerry's switch from the Wolf to the TB, Bob Weir's change from the Gibson to the Ibanez, Keith's discontinuation of the Fender Rhodes, addition of Mickey, which forced a complete overhaul in the band's rhythm section that impacted all of their legacy songs (compare drums on Sugar Magnolia from 1972 to 1976), and a much more expanded vocal role for Donna, as she pretty much replaced Phil on harmonies (she was used much more selectively before 1976, for example, Wharf Rat, Bertha, Ramble On Rose, Uncle Johns Band,Jack Straw, Deal and a ton of others did not feature her at all until after the 76 return to touring, and Phil's voice disappeared). Even the sound system changed dramatically. The point is, there was a much more pronounced and sudden change in sound from 10/20/74 to 6/3/76 (the four appearances in 1975 notwithstanding), than the gradual fine tuning from 67 - 74. It was more of a reformation than an evolution, like you get when bands break up or lose personnel and regroup later with a new sound. In their case it was a very deliberate new path, as if they wanted to shut the door on what they were and be something new. It was as if they broke up and reformed as something new. Still the best damn band in the world!

Sounds good..

My pleasure, man. That Miles Jack Johnson is the shiznit. The original release is okay, but the complete sessions box is some ROCKIN' jazz!

....the Boyz should have taken more breaks/hiatus's. My 3 cents. Love Phish or not, they are doing it right. Bonus point to stolzfus for quoting Day Job lyrics. I, on the the other hand, work ten hour days. A Fool On The Hill?.... ...edit lol. Digging the Augusta '84 Boxilla show. A rager. Not quite '85, but who's counting?

From the somewhat weighty and dark Watergate era of '74 to the sunny Georgia smile of "Have a Nice Day" '76. Jerry seems to be the main driver behind Mickey being in the band originally and rejoining. 'Nuf said.

....but Jerry welcoming Mickey back isn't too far fetched. I mean, family is family. Even with Lenny burning them hard. I never met Jerry, but I look at him as the kindest of souls who happened to play a mean guitar. Lucky us....I miss you

I did meet him once in '83. I couldn't open my mouth nor properly decide what should be said. He was kind, intelligent, gentle and did the speaking for me.. I honestly forget what he said.. but it was light, funny and interesting. Gracious perhaps. Had back stage passes for both nights in Merriweather '83 (thanks Phil). I barely used them and preferred being out in the pavilion. There were I think five of us with passes or perhaps five of us that shared a few passes, I forget.. and we arrived at different times. In the days before cell phones I shared mine with my brother and I got there first.. and was quite done with it by the time the music started. Me and my friends never hooked up back stage, it was just too weird, very weird... perhaps if we arrived together it would have been different. Finally I went to my seats, which were quite good and all seemed ok with the world. I felt more a peace in front of the band than behind it, which exactly suited my state of mind at the time. My night meeting Jerry.. I didn't have it in me to say anything intelligent, but still we had a half minute of pretty interesting dialogue (no thanks to me). In the end, I felt humbled and petty yet strangely honored and proud. Shame on me.. and to all you kids out there, don't smoke pot, never do mushrooms and for gods sake never, ever put little tiny pieces of paper on your tongue. It will rob you of wisdom, at exactly the moment you need it.

...I'm surprised no one is excited about the news of the Grateful Deads upcoming RSD release this April... ...Grateful Dead Fillmore West, San Francisco, CA 2/27/69 (4LP 180 Gram Vinyl)(RSD 2018 Exclusive)... ...I'm very excited that we are being treated to a 2/27/69 vinyl release... ;) ...the art work alone is stunning! Skeletons with hair and beards ? Take a guess everyone

I'm excited and already decided I am getting it (if I can).